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Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

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Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#121

Don't write anything on your resume that would indicate "number of years experience" -- list your jobs, explain key achievements, don't distill anything down to a number. Your resume should NOT explain who you are, or go into real specifics -- it's an advertisement for you, as simple as that. If they want details, they'll have to schedule an interview. Once you have the interview, you can talk about your experiences,…

> Don't write anything on your resume that would indicate "number of years experience"

So hold off on start/end dates at jobs then? Since those could be used to figure out experience?

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#122
post #70
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still doubt the "networking" part. I've got my first job in the states because a recruiter called me. Same for the second job. The third one was through being acquired. The fourth one, you could call networking if you call showing up for a recruiting event networking. 5th one? You guessed it, recruiter called. Sixth one? Yep. Exactly. Before that, I worked in Germany. 1st job, applied cold. Second one, applied cold…

I still get recruiters randomly messaging me. However they're all looking for someone to move laterally, not up. This wasn't the case when I was more junior. Much like salary I find myself wondering if there isn't a limit to finding new opportunities without networking.

> I still get recruiters randomly messaging me.

Define "recruiter".

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#123
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still get recruiters randomly messaging me. However they're all looking for someone to move laterally, not up. This wasn't the case when I was more junior. Much like salary I find myself wondering if there isn't a limit to finding new opportunities without networking.

> I still get recruiters randomly messaging me. Define "recruiter".

People who recruit. I get messages from recruiters who are direct employees of the companies they recruit for, self-employed recruiters and recruiters for contracting shops. Probably a variety of others, too.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work as a contractor and that is kind of similar to what I do. If I have to use a new tech (an important one in the stack but not the main one) I will normally invest 5~10h of my time pre-anything in learning the basics of the stack. Then if I get stuck at something I'll try to fix it first, then learn more about the stack to see if I'm missing something basic and finally ask for help. These go normally for free if…

PS, your comment sounded quite negative/exploiting, probably that's why the downvotes. How is that "exploitive"? When I'm contracting I always get paid 10 -30% more than I could get as an FTE all in - even if I include the cost of benefits, paid time off, the gap between employment, etc. When they want me to work more than 40 hours a week, they pay me for more than 40 hours a week. Companies don't hire contractors ov…

> "When I'm contracting I always get paid 10 -30% more"

From my experience (and quite a few people in a similar situation), as a foreign contractor I am making ~50% less money than FTE are making doing the exactly same job just because of the country I was born in.

I am not charging this learning time because I don't want/need to, but I would certainly not work with a company who would require me to do part of the job for free. However I am in a privileged situation where I can choose. Forcing an employee to do a not-in-the-contract learning for free is exploiting them (because they could have other needs to do in their own time, family, other jobs, etc). If they want to learn something on their own time that would improve their work that's great and definitely a plus, but not everyone can do that.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#125

Four suggestions: 1. Don't obsess over the specifics on an ad. See if the role is in line with what you have to offer, but don't worry if you don't have the exact number of years of experience they request or one of the many skills they added to what it's essentially their wishlist. 2. Provided you have a solid foundation with some standard skills like JavaScript, Python or Ruby, etc, specialize in a relatively new s…

Re #4: I was rejected for a job. The interview process included take-home work AND pair-programming. One of the specific pieces of feedback I got was that my development style wasn't modern enough - with a recommendation that if 'your current employer isn't exposing you to best practices and new approaches you should attend some relevant meetups in [city]'. My personal negative take on that was that meetups tend to c…

> My personal negative take on that was that meetups tend to concentrate on the latest fad.

Or, in the case here in Seattle anymore, whatever the sponsor company is trying to promote.

2/3 of the meetups here anymore are mostly tech's version of timeshare seminars.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#126
side projects are just seen as simple toys from employers.

I instead started a software dev side-company that specializes in minimum viable products for very early-stage entrepreneurs. I fish around Linkedin for clients who pay me anywhere between $1000 and $3000 (i honestly just eyeball the amount). For the most part, I pick the stack or look for clients who want a specific technology so i can learn it. This counts as professional experience since I got paid for it.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PS, your comment sounded quite negative/exploiting, probably that's why the downvotes. How is that "exploitive"? When I'm contracting I always get paid 10 -30% more than I could get as an FTE all in - even if I include the cost of benefits, paid time off, the gap between employment, etc. When they want me to work more than 40 hours a week, they pay me for more than 40 hours a week. Companies don't hire contractors ov…

> "When I'm contracting I always get paid 10 -30% more" From my experience (and quite a few people in a similar situation), as a foreign contractor I am making ~50% less money than FTE are making doing the exactly same job just because of the country I was born in. I am not charging this learning time because I don't want/need to, but I would certainly not work with a company who would require me to do part of the jo…

but I would certainly not work with a company who would require me to do part of the job for free.

If I'm hired as a React developer to implement a set of business requirements, they are hiring me to learn and implement the business requirements. They are not hiring me to learn React. If they hired me with the knowledge that I'm not a seasoned React developer, the expectation is that they will not be expecting me to charge them for my learning React as billable time. How is that unfair? My React skills increase my marketability and I'm investing in myself by learning it.

If a person is not willing to sacrifice to learn skills on their own time, software development is not the field they should be in.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#128
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that FTE's tend to get exploited more. Being hourly means that they usually don't want you to work more than 40 hours/week, and if they do, then you're getting paid for it. Also, it's much easier to shirk the "ownership" aspect of the products. FTE's typically handle the maintenance window in the middle of the night, the deployments, the firefighting. And they don't get paid for it. As a contractor, it's typi…

The biggest difference is not in how the FTEs treat you; I've never had a contract gig where I was treated badly enough to really care. The big difference is the prestige. Getting a FTE job at one of the top tier silicon valley companies is like having a degree from a really prestigious college. People will talk to you about your next gig who wouldn't otherwise talk to you.

I'm not in Silicon Valley, but I have been in a major metropolitan area for 20 years where jobs have always been easy to come by (with the exception of 2008-2011) and where stock options and bonuses aren't plentiful but wages are high enough for seasoned developers to allow you to easily buy a house in the 'burbs with good schools.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#129
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell, the facts on the ground for contract work (which is to say, lower total comp than working as a FTE at one of the local big companies, lower job security, less respect, and generally slightly worse working conditions) means that when you are hiring contractors for a big company, you are hiring from a pool of people who are unable to get the same job at the same sort of company as a FTE. Contracto…

That would put your $90/hr contractor at $162K full time salary; and for base, sure. Base-wise, I'd expect a $90/hr contractor to come out closer to $150K if they converted to full time. But bonus and stock often make up another 30% or more in silicon valley, and you don't get that as a contractor. This was actually the weird part for me, because I did some contracting around here in the aughts, and the pay was sligh…

Where I live, a good software developer can make between 120K and 145K as an FTE and easily bill from 70 - 80/hr as a W2 contractor. Bonuses and stock options aren't too much of thing either way. Maybe about 10-15% of compensation.

Re: Ask HN: How do you pivot your career when jobs want years of exp in a stack

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IME, everyone advises portfolios, but nobody looks at them.

i do.

I will use you as an excuse to keep working on my portfolio when I should really be whiteboarding out fizzbuzz minesweeper in O(logN) time right now.
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