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As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

nytimes.com

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Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#61

Post by cepp »

zdw wrote: post #4

Having just travelled to Beijing, these bikes literally are everywhere, frequently stands of 20-50 or more from the many many companies that offer them outside a subway station, so I can see the pushback about cluttering up the place. Most of the people I talked to are pretty positive on them - it's fairly easy to find one, and they're dirt cheap to ride (most are sub-$0.10/hr if my math is right). I like to think of…

Almost all services are now about $0.07USD/hour, or less and, even better, free on the weekends.

Having just come back from living in Shanghai for some time, nothing makes it more convenient than not having to think about the price.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#62

Post by nearmuse »

devmunchies wrote: post #49

This is a concept that you learn in an intro to economics class in college. People will abuse a free, limited resource. A sharing-based economy doesn't work.

Lived in France for some time, and bike sharing works fairly well. From time to time I've seen vandalized/bad condition/abandoned bikes, but never at the scale described in this article. You authorize something to the tune of 150€ charged from your credit card if bike is not returned on time, which eliminates extreme carelessness. So this is clearly a problem with implementation and said startups, not the sharing economy. There are people who behave like that everywhere.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#63

Post by rixed »

paradite wrote: post #33

A universally applicable phenomenon where lack of ownership leads to uncivil behavior got caught in China due to its sheer scale of sharing economy and NYT says "Great material for China bashing. Make sure we get a good title to reflect how bad China is."

There are also many users behaving properly. Do you have data showing that property does not yield to as much uncivil behavior? Like, for instance, do car owners behave better than shared bike owner?

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#64

Post by askvictor »

juiyout wrote: post #50

If there is money tied to rider's mannerism, I would be confident to predict that almost all the observed issues will be resolved.

I think they have the capacity to do this (o-bikes in Melbourne have similar issues), but haven't enabled it yet while trying to build up a customer base; additionally there is nothing to stop dickheads kicking over parked bikes for no particular reason.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#65

Post by esturk »

xvilka wrote: post #54
devmunchies wrote: post #49

This is a concept that you learn in an intro to economics class in college. People will abuse a free, limited resource. A sharing-based economy doesn't work.

It's not an economic issue, it's a human nature. Just most of the people lack morals, no matter what country. Sad, but true.

What's easier to change? An business model or human nature? Clever people already know not to fight human nature and build their business models around it.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#66

Post by kisstheblade »

Recently visited china and noticed that the people there behave really filthy. They eat their lunches on the go when walking in the city, and when they are done they just dump the styrofoam containers and leftovers right there in the street. Then city workers collect them in huge stinky mounds waiting to be ferried of somewhere. Apparently city living is such a new concept there that a sence of community hasn't evolved and everybody at least would try to take care of the common spaces.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#67

Post by dredmorbius »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #59
Pxtl wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like a pricing issue. Tag the stations by elevation and make a price hike for trips that start at a high station and end at a low one, and vice versa. Does SF not have an organization manually rebalancing teh stations? Here in Hamilton you see pickups with trailers full of rental-bikes being redistributed.

They could even offer negative pricing for bikes that are out of place.

Haul-back bonuses have been used in other domains for decades. Moving vans. Railway cars

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#68

Post by csydas »

forapurpose wrote: post #55
Pxtl wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have a system here in Hamilton Ontario where the bikes require a credit card to access and they include a cellphone/GPS system built into the bike so every bike knows its current location. That seems to reduce the abuse.

> bikes require a credit card to access Many people don't have credit cards (though my information on that is years old; perhaps it's changed?). Doesn't that policy limit access for the people who might need the bikes most?

There's a bit more flexibility on this front with prepaid cards and loadable cards from banks. You can get Visa gift cards in the checkout aisle at most stores which work for most credit card requirements.

It's not super convenient but it does allow for people without bank accounts or good credit to participate.

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#69

Post by m-i-l »

The problem of vandalism might be worse in the UK[0], e.g.

"the scale of vandalism took him [Steve Pyer, Mobike UK's general manager] by surprise. It has been far worse than in any of the Asian countries where Mobike operates 5m bikes"

[0] https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/16/manche...

Re: As Bike-Sharing Brings Out Bad Manners, China Asks, What’s Wrong with Us?

#70

Post by sberder »

chairmanwow wrote: post #39

I am currently living in Shanghai and I use Mobike, Ofo, or 赶赶单车 to get to work everyday. I have logged over 250km between the services. This article is largely unfair. The city has large swaths of sidewalk established as bike parking zones. I can almost always find a bike zone within 10-50m. Furthermore, there are almost always parking attendants and security guards outside of malls and subway stations ensuring that…

Living in Shanghai, closing on 2000km on mobike only. Try going to the flower market on wanhangdu lu and you'll get an idea of the abuse of both bikes and pavement. I love the service and I think it's a fantastic alternative to pubic transports/taxi/DiDi but you can't deny the absolute lack of care of a lot of users.

I regularly see: * Bikes locked with a separate lock * Bikes parked inside compounds you can't access * Bikes parked inside a building on any given floor (it's normal here for people to park their bike or electric scooter just outside their door even in high rise) * Bikes parked on the street in the middle of traffic

Even with those behaviors, those companies have completely reshaped the way people move in Chinese cities.

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