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Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

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Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#91
It is going to be really interesting to see what happens to cryptocurrencies during the next economic downturn.

If their "market caps" aren't decimated then I will be a true believer.

I say this as someone who has owns some of a few different ones.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#92
post #89

It's funny how thick HNers are about Bitcoin. I believe it's evidence of the sort of passive conservatism of the tech community. Bitcoin is some utopian shit, the decentralized technology dream that has a ton of traction, yet many of you just can't seem to get behind it. Is it because YC is an ultra capitalistic investment fund and Bitcoin is just too anarchist for its fanboys? For all the people out there saying, "I…

Except anyone can figure out where my money comes from and where it goes. No thanks!

It still blows my mind that this isn't a bigger issue. Trying to retain any privacy with Bitcoin is an arduous process.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#93

It's funny how thick HNers are about Bitcoin. I believe it's evidence of the sort of passive conservatism of the tech community. Bitcoin is some utopian shit, the decentralized technology dream that has a ton of traction, yet many of you just can't seem to get behind it. Is it because YC is an ultra capitalistic investment fund and Bitcoin is just too anarchist for its fanboys? For all the people out there saying, "I…

The best case scenario for Bitcoin is reaching a consistent price for the rest of its lifetime. That scenario means there's no reason to "invest" in it because ideally it would never change in value.

Only people trying to cash out need people buying in. If you were really invested in the long term you'd rather people not buy in so you can buy more at a lower price.

Bitcoin also has fees. The only reason the fees are lower than credit cards are because people in China can afford to burn electricity at a loss just to turn their Chinese money into anything else.

You still have to pay taxes on the capital gains. And you can't pay taxes in Bitcoin.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#94
post #88

It's 100% bubble. It could go up to $6,000, $50,000, or even $1M. It's not localized like tulips, and it's connected to the internet, so the universe of people available to fuel the speculation is enormous. That the Chinese are highly speculative is what's mainly driving the current price. It has no intrinsic value. It's like gold in that it's not a productive asset. It doesn't yield anything like stocks or bonds. Th…

the china essentialist argument was debunked once CN regulators forced CN exchanges to institute a know-your-customer policy. Result, the bots they used to fluff their order books had to go. You can see this difference from that day onward very clearly in exchange trade volume comparison: https://data.bitcoinity.org/markets/volume/2y?c=e&t=b actaul trade from china is similar or smaller to that in the EU at the momen…

They're not trading. They're holding and creating the price support. The only people who are trading right now are John Q. Public and a few whales who manipulate the market with shill bids.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#95
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just for illegal activity, it just seems like that's a huge percentage of its current use. Not unlike Tor, sadly. It may be more fungible at the moment, but is it anywhere near as safe? Gold goes up and down but nowhere near to the degree we've seen with bitcoin. Add a minimum it's useful in manufacturing so even if the price crash there would still be people to buy it. Rolexes are useful, they have an intri…

Does the FUD you just wrote invalidate the utility I suggested? If, maybe, someday etc. Bitcoin could be worthless. This is very true but money, of any kind, is only worth what people believe it’s worth. And in case you didn’t know, cash is also used for illegal activity...

I'm trying to suggest that it isn't a proven store of value. Just because something has value today doesn't mean it will tomorrow. Gold has centuries of history behind it, Rolex has maybe 100 years. Cash is thousands of years old.

Bitcoin has had a high value for a couple of years. I'm not trying to suggest it's Beanie Babies or Pokémon cards. Obviously those were never useful as real currency and bitcoin can buy things today. But I don't think it's fair to compare it to gold or cash.

And you're right, cash is used for illegal activity. But a HUGE chunk of it's use is for normal legal activity.

There's no real way to know, but I'd be very interested to find out what percentage of bitcoin use is for legal activity. It's a very popular on the dark web because it's so much harder to trace than the normal credit card. They are legal stores on the "normal" internet that take it, but do they process a lot of transactions compared to the illegal stuff?

Calling something FUD usually means that you think someone is mounting some sort of propaganda campaign against someone/something.

That's not me, but the literal meaning fits. I'm afraid people will convert money they can't afford to lose into bitcoin even though we don't know how stable it is long term. I'm uncertain that it can continue to be used as transaction volumes increase. I doubt it's as impenetrable as people think because the US government (among others) is capable of throwing a LOT of computer power at getting enough hashing to manipulate the block chain.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#96
post #89

It's funny how thick HNers are about Bitcoin. I believe it's evidence of the sort of passive conservatism of the tech community. Bitcoin is some utopian shit, the decentralized technology dream that has a ton of traction, yet many of you just can't seem to get behind it. Is it because YC is an ultra capitalistic investment fund and Bitcoin is just too anarchist for its fanboys? For all the people out there saying, "I…

Except anyone can figure out where my money comes from and where it goes. No thanks!

Okay. So I'm anyone. How am I going to know what your addresses are? Starting from where I am right now all the way over here. You did say anyone.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#97

It's 100% bubble. It could go up to $6,000, $50,000, or even $1M. It's not localized like tulips, and it's connected to the internet, so the universe of people available to fuel the speculation is enormous. That the Chinese are highly speculative is what's mainly driving the current price. It has no intrinsic value. It's like gold in that it's not a productive asset. It doesn't yield anything like stocks or bonds. Th…

> the Chinese are highly speculative

It's almost crazy how gambling and stock bubbles are nearly unheard of in Europe or America, precisely because of how seldom those peoples speculate.

To think, if it wasn't for Jinan province's tulip mania, we'd barely understand the phenomenon of speculative bubbles. Or maybe it was Dandong, I forget.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#98
post #89

It's funny how thick HNers are about Bitcoin. I believe it's evidence of the sort of passive conservatism of the tech community. Bitcoin is some utopian shit, the decentralized technology dream that has a ton of traction, yet many of you just can't seem to get behind it. Is it because YC is an ultra capitalistic investment fund and Bitcoin is just too anarchist for its fanboys? For all the people out there saying, "I…

Except anyone can figure out where my money comes from and where it goes. No thanks!

[deleted]

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people buy gold for “post apocalypse” scenarios. How well is the bitcoin network going to work in the post apocalypse?

In a true, real post apocalyptic world, you can't eat gold, you can't have sex with it, it will not cure your sickness nor will it feed your vices; therefore, it has little to no value.

But someone might exchange that gold with you for food, for sex, for medicine, and for what feeds your vices, as they have for millennia.

Re: Bitcoin Gets Close to $5,000

#100

It's 100% bubble. It could go up to $6,000, $50,000, or even $1M. It's not localized like tulips, and it's connected to the internet, so the universe of people available to fuel the speculation is enormous. That the Chinese are highly speculative is what's mainly driving the current price. It has no intrinsic value. It's like gold in that it's not a productive asset. It doesn't yield anything like stocks or bonds. Th…

> the Chinese are highly speculative It's almost crazy how gambling and stock bubbles are nearly unheard of in Europe or America, precisely because of how seldom those peoples speculate. To think, if it wasn't for Jinan province's tulip mania, we'd barely understand the phenomenon of speculative bubbles. Or maybe it was Dandong, I forget.

The Chinese speculate more
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