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U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

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Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$250k base or $250k INCLUDING stock??

The second one, but if you're not thinking about salary in terms of total comp, you're doing it wrong.

Ahhh, that explains it. When the market crashes, you become plebs like the rest of us. Except you'll be living in the most expensive place in the country.

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the market is free, eventually it gets sold. In this case, that means legislating artificial surplus in the form of increased H1 visas.

Even then the market clears. The equilibrium under H1 is different than without H1 but there's still an equilibrium.

I'm not sure what your point is: that it is the preferable state of affairs simply because it has found stability?

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#263
post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The super efficient middle management in EU companies is even more extraordinary claim then the exploited poor eastern European programmer.

Middle management is oftentimes remote, in another EU country with higher salaries and job security (Sweden, Germany, Netherlands). "Efficient" is sarcastic - meaning more "manipulative" and "micromanaging".

Out of curiosity, are you talking about Accenture? Cause they have quite bad reputation around here ...

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is true in certain cases, but not all. I just offered an unemployed family member (and recent computer science grad) a freelance opportunity worth $100 an hour to build out a simple e-commerce site. They didn't want the work. I think part of the problem is that you can have a lot of "fun" these days for very cheap (video games, YouTube, etc). Maybe it's time for us to reexamine why people don't even want high-pa…

I'm in a pretty small secondary market and was recently advised by someone who knows what he is talking about to never accept less than $200/hr for contract work. That is the going rate around here and accepting less signals that you don't know what you are doing. Perhaps the $100/hr isn't as much as you think it is. More so if you are somewhere expensive like San Francisco or New York.

Can you hint at your market? I'm in a sizable market and my competitors are in the 125-150 range. I think I produce better work, but my first few major projects that lasted a few years are only now winding down and I'm out seeking new work. I'd like to experiment with different pricing strategies with the positive reputation I've accumulated.

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#265
Employers are unwilling to invest in employees. Then they wonder why the (good) employees they do have don't stick around.

U.S. labor market: Everyone running around, looking for "something for nothing." We had a couple decades of outsourcing and off-shoring, coming from this perspective (and law and regulation effectively neutered on its behalf).

Let's hope the MBA's and short-term-focused executives find out just how fungible they are. (A suit is, after all, just a suit.)

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company can find "other labor sources" then they really don't have a reason to say "we can't find labor". Employers are saying "there is a shortage of workers" when what they really mean is "the market price for workers is more than we want to pay" or "we don't want to share more of the profits with the employees (who actually make the product) then we used to". To "fix" this, they want some sort of special trea…

If bread costs 100$ per loaf, and people are literally starving to death in the streets because they can't pay for food, is this just the "market clearing rate" for bread where supply is meeting demand, or is there a shortage of bread?

Wouldn't more bakeries enter the market in this scenario?

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#267
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like there's two tiers of the software industry: those employable at AmaFaceGoogFlix or a competitor, and everyone else; but the "everyone else" is completely unaware that the first tier exists. It's like if minor league baseball had no idea about major league baseball. You even see it on HN. Someone will come along and talk about how a senior dev at Google can expect $250k a year. You'll get two categories of…

I still don't believe the $250k figure :) I make exactly half of that here in Florida (a fairly low cost area) as a senior dev and my salary has definitely plateaued (and I haven't had a raise in a few years). I know I make more than most of my peers and local recruiters scoff when I tell them my current pay (I had to talk my current employer up about $30k just to match my salary at my previous employer to get me to…

Do you mean that you actually don't believe it? As in, "I think that's a false statement"? Or do you mean that you're jokingly in "a state of disbelief", as in… surprised or taken aback?

I have friends in low cost areas that make around what you're describing. They don't continue doing that because of willful disbelief, they understand that they could move and make 2.5x their current income. They just like the lifestyle. Which, totally makes sense to me. It's an amazing lifestyle.

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company can find "other labor sources" then they really don't have a reason to say "we can't find labor". Employers are saying "there is a shortage of workers" when what they really mean is "the market price for workers is more than we want to pay" or "we don't want to share more of the profits with the employees (who actually make the product) then we used to". To "fix" this, they want some sort of special trea…

If bread costs 100$ per loaf, and people are literally starving to death in the streets because they can't pay for food, is this just the "market clearing rate" for bread where supply is meeting demand, or is there a shortage of bread?

You could have a point if it cost $10 million to hire a senior competent software engineer. It does not.

You could have a point if bread cost $75 to produce. It does not.

Many of the companies complaining about a shortage of people are posting record profits. Workers are receiving the smallest share of the pie in many decades.

In many cases this really is just stingy employers complaining because they want to keep most of the profit for themselves.

In other cases businesses can't raise prices because their customers don't have any money (because wages are so low and the 1% captures so much economic surplus, stashing it away in investment accounts, causing investors to dash around shoveling tons of cash at anything that looks like yield). In this case hiring workers at higher wages wouldn't be sustainable without raising prices. The "solution" in this scenario is not to suppress worker's wages even further; that only makes the problem worse. The solution is much higher taxes on the ultra-rich to filter the money out of investments and back into the economy where 10: it can be spent by workers, raising profits, leading to expansion, higher pay, more spending, more profits, goto 10.

If we were in a capital-constrained environment then it would make sense to cut taxes to make more capital available for investment. We aren't. We haven't been in decades. Taxes on income & capital gains >10m should be much higher.

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like there's two tiers of the software industry: those employable at AmaFaceGoogFlix or a competitor, and everyone else; but the "everyone else" is completely unaware that the first tier exists. It's like if minor league baseball had no idea about major league baseball. You even see it on HN. Someone will come along and talk about how a senior dev at Google can expect $250k a year. You'll get two categories of…

> I know it's considered bad negotiation it's not. the more assertive you are with your compensation requirements, the more likely you are to get paid what you want. i don't know where this crazy idea of "don't tell anyone what you want to be paid" came from, it sounds like some real amateur hour nonsense that will get you passed up in favor of someone who is more straight forward with the entire process. imagine try…

> imagine trying to buy a product or service, but nobody will tell you how much it costs, but instead tries to subtly hint that you should name your price

There are tons of products that don't have a listed prices, just a "call our sales representatives". Heck, the job listings don't list salary expectations, even when they're cold calling you.

Re: U.S. Employers Struggle to Match Workers with Open Jobs

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know it's considered bad negotiation it's not. the more assertive you are with your compensation requirements, the more likely you are to get paid what you want. i don't know where this crazy idea of "don't tell anyone what you want to be paid" came from, it sounds like some real amateur hour nonsense that will get you passed up in favor of someone who is more straight forward with the entire process. imagine try…

> imagine trying to buy a product or service, but nobody will tell you how much it costs, but instead tries to subtly hint that you should name your price There are tons of products that don't have a listed prices, just a "call our sales representatives". Heck, the job listings don't list salary expectations, even when they're cold calling you .

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