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How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

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Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#181

I encourage a little more thought before cheering this on as a win. While GDPR isn't as ridiculous as the Cookie Law, it still shows that the EU/EC don't understand the technology they are trying to regulate, and it comes at a huge cost to tech companies. Take the right to be forgotten . First of all, it should be common sense that no one has the right to force legitimate news articles to disappear because they don't…

> First of all, it should be common sense that no one has the right to force legitimate news articles to disappear because they don't like the content, but that is what the EU has ruled should happen. No, it is about deleting personal data attached to your user account, not "news articles". This thing intends to make the "delete my account" button to actually, you know, "delete my account", instead of fake-deleting i…

You missed the point: if I take an image backup of a disk and store it, even in encrypted format, and it contains John Doe's account, and he comes along and asks for his account deleted, I would have to purge not just my database record, but the backups images from the past as well. That invalidates ALL of my backups. It's not often practical to backup INDIVIDUAL users..

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#182

And if you think GDPR is a toothless joke, let's take a look at the defined fine stucture. It is pretty simple, only 3 levels (strikes for the fellow Americans): Strike 1 - Stern warning letter Strike 2 - 2% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE Strike 3 - 4% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE (or 20mil EUR, whichever is higher) And now you know why GDPR is a board level topic. Keep in mind that the EU/US Safe Harbor agreement got…

Why is it Global revenue? It seems presumptive for the EU to want a share of their global revenue rather than EU revenue

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#183

And if you think GDPR is a toothless joke, let's take a look at the defined fine stucture. It is pretty simple, only 3 levels (strikes for the fellow Americans): Strike 1 - Stern warning letter Strike 2 - 2% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE Strike 3 - 4% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE (or 20mil EUR, whichever is higher) And now you know why GDPR is a board level topic. Keep in mind that the EU/US Safe Harbor agreement got…

In addition to the solutions you mentioned, This might create more jobs at facebook and google as compliance will take a huge amount of effort. I predict, lawyers are going to make a lot of money on this.

It may be doable for big companies but does this mean startups will be more likely to delay entry to the EU market?

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#184
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of these companies do business in the EU, have offices and employees in the EU, etc. They are clearly subject to EU jurisdiction. They could shut down all their European operations, but that would cost them a lot more than 4% of revenue.

They could shut down all their European operations, but that would cost them a lot more than 4% of revenue. There's an interesting assumption in there, and I'm not entirely sure it's a correct one. Facebook and its subsidiaries play a large part in many people's everyday lives now, in particular forming the main way a lot of people stay in touch with their friends and family. It is not at all clear to me what would h…

What if they said 'sorry but -- starting next month, we will have to charge you for accessing parts of facebook. We will have to do this until the EU changes the law.

I bet customers would rally against the law rather than pay microtransactions.

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#185
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google has assets within the EU which means ignoring EU laws is not an option, unless Google are prepared to forfeit those assets. It's not really a decision they have the authority to make anyhow. Imagine the shareholder lawsuits!

Shareholders filing lawsuits because the company refused to give away money to a fine?

Shareholders filing lawsuits because the company refused to follow the EU law

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#186
post #95

I encourage a little more thought before cheering this on as a win. While GDPR isn't as ridiculous as the Cookie Law, it still shows that the EU/EC don't understand the technology they are trying to regulate, and it comes at a huge cost to tech companies. Take the right to be forgotten . First of all, it should be common sense that no one has the right to force legitimate news articles to disappear because they don't…

> it comes at a huge cost to tech companies Doesn't it just affect companies which rely heavily on lack of privacy for monetisation? I think that's sort of the point - that your business should not rely on tracking individuals and selling that information without their consent to gov/private bodies. It's obviously a huge change, since so many big tech players rely on this to make profits. But the internet will be a m…

"the application of the GDPR will prevent them from using these personal data for any further purpose unless the user permits."

This seems incredibly broad from the article and would touch nearly every startup. Maybe there are limits on the businesses affected? Otherwise I'm not sure how one could formally define "rely heavily on lack of privacy for monetisation."

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#187
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can see what happens in these circumstances based on when China blocked services. People stop using it as much. That seems particularly bad for Facebook, given the network effects it relies on.

Counterpoint: When the Internet went "dark" over SOPA, people noticed, and SOPA died. If everyone in Europe woke up one morning next year to find Facebook saying that as a result of new EU law they had been required to turn off their service and please would everyone write to their representatives (using the form conveniently provided below) to ask why they'd done this, what do you think would happen?

For a lot of people, if not nearly all of them, it's a lot less effort to migrate to a new social network with your friends than it is to lobby to have some laws repealed, especially when it's clear that these laws are in the interest of the public and have been put together with serious thought and consultation.

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#188

And if you think GDPR is a toothless joke, let's take a look at the defined fine stucture. It is pretty simple, only 3 levels (strikes for the fellow Americans): Strike 1 - Stern warning letter Strike 2 - 2% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE Strike 3 - 4% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE (or 20mil EUR, whichever is higher) And now you know why GDPR is a board level topic. Keep in mind that the EU/US Safe Harbor agreement got…

I'll eat my shoe if a regulator ever gets even 2% total global revenue out of any of the top 100 software companies based on this.

In reality a bunch of small shops are going to go bankrupt because they don't have a "GDPR implementation" position filled and they didn't do some report properly.

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#189

And if you think GDPR is a toothless joke, let's take a look at the defined fine stucture. It is pretty simple, only 3 levels (strikes for the fellow Americans): Strike 1 - Stern warning letter Strike 2 - 2% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE Strike 3 - 4% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE (or 20mil EUR, whichever is higher) And now you know why GDPR is a board level topic. Keep in mind that the EU/US Safe Harbor agreement got…

    For startups - GDPR is like Y2K at the time, a GOLDMINE. So much opportunity to sell solutions, from real to snake oil. GDPR compliance is already and will continue to trigger a massive wave of investment.
I'll start by saying that I have found myself leaning in favor of this law -- I've made a much longer comment about it and won't rehash it, but I wanted to make sure my statements that followed weren't taken as a blanket anti-GDPR but rather a devil's advocate response.

I take issue with the quoted statement because it ignores the downside for startups[0]. Companies like Google, Facebook et. al., have the money and time to hire teams of lawyers to find a way to work around these regulations in a manner that maximises their ability to continue tracking while minimising their risk in getting smacked by the hand of the law. Getting hauled off to court won't bankrupt them and they have the legal teams to probably win regularly enough. Even barring that, they have the finances to adjust their business to be fully compliant (in whatever degree business adjustments require) without going bankrupt.

Joe's Advertising Supported Free Service does not. Joe's not going to start his own ad network and start mining personal data for it -- it's way too expensive to try to compete with Google/Facebook (and it was already way too expensive to do it, before). If he does, he's the one who's going to get hit with the second and third strike; probably from that "single pissed off German customer".

Investing in firms that touch this space will be met with far more skepticism. I wouldn't be surprised if any company that simply asks for a user ID and password won't face a little scrutiny from investors, at least until the regulatory atmosphere is understood (I doubt it'll be that extreme for terribly long, but one bad court ruling/fine laid out where it wasn't expected could change that). The cost of establishing many, many kinds of companies will now increase because the risks are high enough that going to market without having your legal bases covered on this one. That money has now been shifted to a business who -- potentially -- is selling snake-oil (and startups are going to be more likely to do business with that snake-oil salesman since they'll probably also be the least expensive).

Then there's the "unintended consequences". Here's a crazy hypothetical, but a lesser variation of it is plausible if this were a US law: Some individual exercises his free-speech rights and chucks something up on the Internet that has a bunch of horrible things on it, say, like 'a guide on how to slaughter and prepare kittens for healthy and inexpensive dinners'. Some kid reads it and kills/eats his neighbor's cat. The guy didn't do anything illegal, really, but his web host knocks him off the web and people are calling for blood. He happens to use an ad-network, but doesn't, himself, collect personal information. However, this ad-network does, and at one point was nailed under this law. He uses the ad-network, so some overzealous prosecutor figures out a way to bring it in front of a judge that he's responsible for what this third-party did and should also be prosecuted. At the height of outrage, a jury isn't hard to find to connect the dots[1].

[0] And hey, that's fine, you're an internet commenting individual just like me -- we don't have to present both sides of the story -- that's the replier's job.

[1] Yeah, I took that a little far, but I think back to when "The Columbine Massacre" happened and everyone believed it was FPS video games that warped those evil children's "precious little minds". It took all of two seconds to call for banning violent video games (constitution be dammed), many idiotic and ultimately overturned laws were passed, and if there was some way to haul the developers who wrote the game off to jail (I think they were blaming DOOM at the time), it would have been possible within those first few weeks.

Re: How the GDPR Will Disrupt Google and Facebook

#190
post #182

And if you think GDPR is a toothless joke, let's take a look at the defined fine stucture. It is pretty simple, only 3 levels (strikes for the fellow Americans): Strike 1 - Stern warning letter Strike 2 - 2% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE Strike 3 - 4% of your TOTAL GLOBAL REVENUE (or 20mil EUR, whichever is higher) And now you know why GDPR is a board level topic. Keep in mind that the EU/US Safe Harbor agreement got…

Why is it Global revenue? It seems presumptive for the EU to want a share of their global revenue rather than EU revenue

I assume it's because it's less easy to game, rather than say "oops we made all our money in Switzerland that year".
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