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24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

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Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#231
post #81

the devil is in the DAC and ADC. You just can't turn 16bit/24bit data directly to/from analog without much loss. The 1/65536 accuracy voltage divider simply don't exist. So, you have to up-sample the songs to high rates with less bits, like 1bit to 6bits, then do the conversion, and get the best SNR you can. In this sense, there's simply a lot of advantage of using 24/196 since the above conversion can result in less…

why was this down-voted too? it's the truth!

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#232

I've done signal and sound-processing courses at the university. I know the Nyquist-Shannon theorem. I know all about samples, and digital sound not been square staircases. I know and understand how incorrect down-sampling from high frequencies can cause distortion in the form of sub-harmonics in the audioable range. I know about audible dynamic range and how many decibels of extra range 8-bits are going to give you.…

I collect vintage headphones, and especially relish the truly absurd ones I can't believe anyone thought were a saleable item.

I'm up to about 300 different models.

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#233
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that sitting in front of a speaker setup playing a carefully selected recording is not the same as the scenario above. We do not yet have the technology to fool someone walking by a room, especially for orchestral works or even an acoustic drum kit.

But I have experienced exactly this. Not an orchestra, but a recording of a band. I guess you can split hairs about the definition of "fool", but I have been fooled as you describe.

Well that's exciting then! What was the setup??

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#234

My go to comparison track for sound quality for a new device, headphones, DAC, amp, codec etc, is "Speak To Me" from Dark Side Of The Moon. I don't hear a difference between various rips that are 16/128 or 24/192, but I have noticed a difference listening to the Blu-ray version of it (which is many-many gigabytes in size). It is a definitely interesting experience, but the way I can describe it is as an absolute abse…

Hah. I use the Dark Side of the Moon album for comparisons as well. I find that you need to use something that you are very well acquainted with. Oddly enough I also use Electric Heart, by Sia, as it has such a bizarrely flooded mid-range :)

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#235
post #226

Am I the only one who have no idea what 16/44.1 or 16/48 mean? I initially thought 192 here was referring to 192 vs 320 etc but this is apparently about something completely different?

bit depth / sample rate

common sample rates are 44.1 and 48 kHz and multiples: 96 kHz ... 192 kHz

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#236

Not entirely silly. Yes, the purported benefits of this high-fidelity audio are imaginary or even include undesirable traits. However, when most "remasters" of pop music today involve the dynamics being boosted to "loudness wars" standards for a target audience of people listening to the music through earbuds in the street, the 24/192 downloads or SACD releases are often the only way to hear the album with real dynam…

How does 24/192 help with dynamic range?

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#237
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that because of the HQ audio, or because the processing software introduces less artifacts at those sample rates/bit depths? I.e. could you get the same results by up-sampling CD quality audio?

More bits means: • Less quantisation noise, so your noise floor is a bit lower and therefore, when you're mixing stuff together, you accumulate less noise • More numerical room to play with, you can scale or shift the volume up and down more without clipping and with less loss of accuracy With 16-bit CD audio, you can't just convert to 24-bit and suddenly have less noise. You might get more room, though. As for highe…

filters with a sharper cutoff will 'ring' more, smearing sharp changes in the signal out over time. It's a pretty subtle effect when it's all happening above 20 kHz though

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#238

If you are downloading to simply consume, then sure. But as others have noted this article assumes that mastering is always the last step in the editing process. Anyone who ever remixed, sampled or DJ'ed will disagree. If we keep that in mind, then the setup of the problem changes significantly and most arguments made here do not apply to the download itself.

> Anyone who ever remixed, sampled or DJ'ed will disagree.

Could you expand on this?

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't tell if this is sarcasm or not, but I think that's sort of the point. You want a high enough pixel density so you can't perceive pixels at normal viewing distance, and I can definitely see pixels on my 42in 1080p screen from across the room.

I'm going to go for "sarcasm" there. I use a 65" 4k TV with my HTPC in the living room, but often do desktop-ish things on it. (Logitech's wireless keyboards are great). The difference in resolution between 1080 and 2160 is huge. 1080 is just fuzzy.

65 freaking inches! Of course you are gonna need 4k

Re: 24/192 Music Downloads Are Very Silly Indeed (2012)

#240

Not entirely silly. Yes, the purported benefits of this high-fidelity audio are imaginary or even include undesirable traits. However, when most "remasters" of pop music today involve the dynamics being boosted to "loudness wars" standards for a target audience of people listening to the music through earbuds in the street, the 24/192 downloads or SACD releases are often the only way to hear the album with real dynam…

How does 24/192 help with dynamic range?

That's the 24-bit part, which provides more play room then 16-bit. Normally 16 is plenty, by consider an example track which is heavily compressed so only the top 1% of range is used:

16-bits = 2^16 * 0.01 = 655 discrete levels

24-bits = 2^24 * 0.01 = 168000 discrete levels

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