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A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

nytimes.com

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Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#31

Post by Tepix »

taneq wrote: post #21
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

to be completely pedantic, i already control all games i play with my mind... more seriously, i worked on a brain-computer interface (BCI) system a few years ago that was supposed to do directional control of a cursor from scalp EEG recordings. A $90 eye tracker worked an order of magnitude better and three orders faster.

> A $90 eye tracker worked an order of magnitude better and three orders faster. For VR, you could even just use the headset's forward-vector, making it like Cardboard's 'look to select' interface.

But that's very straining when doing it for any extended period of time.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#33

Post by Sir_Substance »

kortex wrote: post #10
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

to be completely pedantic, i already control all games i play with my mind... more seriously, i worked on a brain-computer interface (BCI) system a few years ago that was supposed to do directional control of a cursor from scalp EEG recordings. A $90 eye tracker worked an order of magnitude better and three orders faster.

I've spent a lot of time working with EEG and pulling my hair out over garbage SNR, finnicky setups, and artifacts galore. I don't understand why so many folks try to go the route of using EEG as mouse/keyboard/generic HID for the masses, when (ignoring para/quadraplegics) most humans have no problem with computer input. There are tons of applications where the EEG can be used for what it's (sorta) good at: attention…

>pulling my hair out over garbage SNR

I bought into the OCZ NIA about a decade ago. Nice unit, but I was using it within about 2m of a set of AC/DC plugpack transformers. It had a SNR visualiser, and you could see it go increasingly ballistic as I moved my head towards and away from the powerboard.

I have my sincere doubts that EEG devices can ever function satisfactorily in residential homes. Too many microwaves and fridges, turns out there's a reason hospital EEGs are done in faraday cage rooms.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#34

Post by yoz-y »

Tepix wrote: post #32

Would interpreting the EEG in terms of commands given work more reliably if there were more sensors? If so, why are there so few sensors? If not, why not?

It mostly depends on what paradigm you are using. They seem to use the P300 response (your brain's response to an "anticipated surprise") which indeed benefits quite a lot from additional sensors because the response can be found all over the brain. If they were using motor imagery then you only need electrodes on the sensory-motor cortex.

First concern is cost, additional sensors of good quality are expensive (for example, a single g.Tec dry electrode costs about 100 euros). If you use gel electrodes (which are vastly superior to dry electrodes) then you add preparation time.

One of the biggest hurdles of EEG for games is practicality. People were annoyed when they had to spend a few seconds calibrating their Kinect, now imagine you would have to spend 5-15 minutes donning and calibrating the system each time you wished to play.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#35

Post by yoz-y »

hprotagonist wrote: post #20
kortex wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've spent a lot of time working with EEG and pulling my hair out over garbage SNR, finnicky setups, and artifacts galore. I don't understand why so many folks try to go the route of using EEG as mouse/keyboard/generic HID for the masses, when (ignoring para/quadraplegics) most humans have no problem with computer input. There are tons of applications where the EEG can be used for what it's (sorta) good at: attention…

Yup. IN fact, our application was locked-in patients. SSVEP BCI "works", but only if you can foveate on the target, which means you can move your eyes, which means you should use an eye tracker.

There are quite a lot of papers that show you can actually modulate SSVEP response even without eye movement. Their protocol was quite fascinating, they used a swarm of targets with four frequencies all intermingled. You had vertical and horizontal (short) lines which were either blue or red. One would control the system by concentrating on blue horizontal stripes for example. Of course the throughput was quite low even for a BCI. I think more research in this vein could reveal some interesting possibilities.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#36

Post by yoz-y »

dbish wrote: post #29
efoto wrote: post #28

If you want to experiment with an EEG device, that works look at Muse. They emphasize meditation feedback, but you can access your EEG raw data. http://www.choosemuse.com/research/

I've been wanting to get one to try some ideas out, but trying to decide if the $200 is worth it. Do you have a muse? What do you use it for?

In general headsets which have only electrodes on the front make for great blink detectors.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#37

Post by AgnesRules »

For real, this is one step before full VR reality and loss of humanity. Once people will have a choice between living there life and going full fantasy-mod of there choice there will be problems. It's nice that tech. goes forward, but we should step gently. Otherwise ''Roy: A Life Well Lived'' arcades will pop up everywhere.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#38

Post by no1youknowz »

AgnesRules wrote: post #37

For real, this is one step before full VR reality and loss of humanity. Once people will have a choice between living there life and going full fantasy-mod of there choice there will be problems. It's nice that tech. goes forward, but we should step gently. Otherwise ''Roy: A Life Well Lived'' arcades will pop up everywhere.

This is one argument as to why we don't see any ET life.

Once they reach a sufficient level of technology, instead of going outward, they go inward. Creating Matrioshka Brains and living in virtual worlds.

Here's a video by the excellent Isaac Arthur: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ef-mxjYkllw

Another one by Joe Scott: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJOKb1_aBM0

If it indeed turns out that we are living in a simulation, then I guess the question then begs. Why not live in a simulation of your own rules and making? What would be so wrong with that?

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#39

Post by CM30 »

AgnesRules wrote: post #37

For real, this is one step before full VR reality and loss of humanity. Once people will have a choice between living there life and going full fantasy-mod of there choice there will be problems. It's nice that tech. goes forward, but we should step gently. Otherwise ''Roy: A Life Well Lived'' arcades will pop up everywhere.

Or in other words, the future of The Matrix or other lotus eater machines isn't being tricked into using them, but being offered the chance to play your favourite online games/watch your favourite films/take part in your fantasies for eternity.

Re: A Game You Can Control with Your Mind

#40

Post by hugh7 »

AgnesRules wrote: post #37

For real, this is one step before full VR reality and loss of humanity. Once people will have a choice between living there life and going full fantasy-mod of there choice there will be problems. It's nice that tech. goes forward, but we should step gently. Otherwise ''Roy: A Life Well Lived'' arcades will pop up everywhere.

Why do you think most CEO's or your fav celeb jumps out of bed every morning? Most of them are addicted to whatever real world "game" they are involved in. No VR required.
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