Leaving Python for JavaScript

> Sounds like he likes js because it's easier to use callback hell with multiline anonymous functions.

Sounds like you're more pissed off at the article because it contradicts your views than anything else. Sounds like you didn't even pay full attention to it.

Yes, those who assumed I meant you can't pass an anonymous multi-line function to another were obviously right -- it dazzles me people spent so much time arguing over this point. There's not much else to it.

I'll just say: that's definitely NOT the sole reason -- I point out several other factors that weighed in my decision in making JS my #1 choice. Above all, after seeing a few successful large projects deployed (and no issues in production), I just came to trust the Node.js stability and ecosystem.

> Hm, actually, it's not. I'm surprised by this comment. I point out precisely the JavaScript features that weighed the most in my decision: "So with JavaScript you've got arrow functions, the method shorthand definition syntax, the spread operator, destructuring assignments, all functional Array methods and async functions. Combined with Vue's minimal patterns and Nuxt's conventions, I can't think of a better language to write web applications in."

I saw that. I guess I just expected you to go into detail about why you believe things like that are better. I use JS a lot in my day-to-day work for the front end of my web application. I also use Django and Python for my back-end. I'm well aware of the differences between Python and Javascript as they are the two languages I work with the most. I would not consider either language "better" than the other except at specific tasks. i.e. I can't really use python to build an SPA and it would be a pain to use Javascript for anything involving heavy number manipulation. I guess what I'm saying is that you should always choose the right tool for the job; sometimes that will Python and sometimes it will be JS. Other times, it might be something else. I'm always a little confused when someone decides that they're going to start writing everything in a particular language even when other languages are more suitable for the task.

> Exactly that, a "function body", "closure", "inline function", whatever you wanna call it. In Python there are lambdas, but they're limited and not even encouraged anymore. We're left with passing function references, and that's where JavaScript comes out the winner IMHO.

To each their own I guess. I feel like programmers these days automatically assume that more functional == more good. There are cases where using FP techniques is definitely advantageous. However, there are also circumstances where OOP is a better choice. I find that Python is equally capable of both paradigms. The idea of anonymous callbacks is good from a productivity standpoint, but readability suffers. Anonymous functions in general cause cryptic error messages and are difficult to debug. I've found that the over use of anonymous functions can also lead to a lot of duplicate code. There are many cases when an anonymous callback would be better if refactored into a named function. I believe that having more named functions aids in creating an efficient program compostion, even when using the FP paradigm. There is one use case where Javscript is much better suited than Python: web applications front ends. This comes as no surprise as JS was designed for exactly that purpose. Asynchronous callbacks and promises cannot be beat when dealing with fetching data from an API.

Like any other developer out there, I collected some bad experiences in my growth. In my 14-year career, 2015-2016 were spectacularly bad years for me, definitely the worst. It has to do with focus and productivity, not competence.

I must say I didn't think it was so bad as to leave this kind of sentiment behind. If you worked with me in that period, perhaps you'll be pleased to read this:

http://hire.jonasgalvez.com.br/2017/Jul/16/My-Approach-to-Re...

Since then I'm confident all my current employers will wholeheartedly vouch for the quality and persistence of my work, as you can easily peak from my GitHub graph.

http://github.com/galvez

I flagged your post nonetheless.

I believe HN is no place for ad hominem attacks.

httplib2 isn't my library, it's Joe Gregorio's, one of the best developers you'll ever read about.

As for the "if you say X, you're incompetent" line of arguing, seriously? If I say I prefer a language because it makes me write functional code faster (in my perception) and disagree that Python is better than JavaScript then I'm incompetent? Seriously, guys?

BTW, I dig Armin Ronacher's work too. His Python code, how beautiful it may look, doesn't diminish any of the points I raised about JavaScript nor my love for it.

I'm done paying attention to this thread.

what does functional programming have to do with it? you still unit test functions in functional programming surely?

> It's like saying all data should be declared as variable, in the functional programming paradigm, functions are data. That's why closures are useful.

I don't think you understand what you're talking about. We were already talking about using 'functions as data', and closures and anonymous functions aren't the same thing.

But anyway, how do you unit test an anonymous function?

I assume you mean that you don't, you just test the bigger context around it. But that was my point, once your anonymous function starts becoming much bigger than a one-liner it ought to be tested itself.