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Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

nytimes.com

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Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#41

Post by etjossem »

Networking makes us feel dirty — to the point that one study found that people rate soap and toothpaste 19 percent more positively after imagining themselves angling to make professional contacts at a cocktail party.

Tip for writers: if you can use the same data to just as reasonably arrive at the opposite conclusion - "we want to feel clean and presentable before impressing other people" - then don't present your vague conjecture as fact. The article started to lose me as soon as I read this part. It was like a red flag of bad journalism went up.

People who have something to show for themselves find networking easier than people who are faking it? Sure, I believe that, but that's hardly news.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#42

Post by mattlondon »

loco5niner wrote: post #35
mattlondon wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to nit-pick but perhaps try - "them" instead of "her" - "they" instead of "she" Much more gender-neutral this way - no implications (intentional or non-intentional) about someone needing help because they are female.

An honest attempt to be politically sensitive (say 'she' instead of 'he' sometimes) gets put down for not going far enough. Not helping the cause here.

The point I was trying to make is when referring to unspecified third-persons, dont say "help her". Say "help them".

Women are often unfairly stereotyped as being less-skilled or less-capable than their male counter-parts in our industry. Suggesting those that need help are female is just the thin-end of the wedge on this and may go unnoticed by those using it - a "micro-aggression" as it is now being called - but it furthers the entrenched stereotyping.

Using well-accepted gender neutral pronouns is a simple step to avoid this sort of thing and try and promote equality and diversity in our industry.

If I have offended anyone, sorry - that was not the intention. The intention was to promote gender equality and make our industry more welcoming to all genders.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#43

Post by antisthenes »

fnbr wrote: post #21

The thing about networking is that good networking is extremely important, but that's not what "Networking" is. In every job I have, I try to grab lunch with people everyday so that I can talk to them and get to know them. I also try to regularly meet new people in my field and get to know them. I've found that to be extremely valuable. However, I've found going to networking events to be an extreme waste of time. Th…

So how does one break out of this catch-22?

How do you become a successful professional if you're never given the opportunity to earn trust where it is also visible enough to develop a strong network?

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#44

Post by pm90 »

anotherbrownguy wrote: post #26

The article gives example of Justin Bieber and Adele. For those two examples, there are hundreds who got where they are just because they knew someone important. Miley Cyrus, Jaden Smith, Charlie Sheen, Ben Stiller, Angelina Jolie, Paris Hilton. Actors/singers make very poor examples for this given that most of them mostly get to where they are by networking more than anything else. Lets say there was an absolute mas…

> Someone who only cares about a better paying job should spend 90% of their time in networking and 10% on honing their profession because networking is all that matters. Someone who absolutely loves their work will happily do their share of work for a lower pay.

As depressing as this seems, it does really seem to be the case. And it seems to be even more accentuated for non-programming jobs. At least in software, we have some kind of test (as flawed as it might be).

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#45

Post by ghaff »

mattlondon wrote: post #42
loco5niner wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An honest attempt to be politically sensitive (say 'she' instead of 'he' sometimes) gets put down for not going far enough. Not helping the cause here.

The point I was trying to make is when referring to unspecified third-persons, dont say "help her". Say "help them". Women are often unfairly stereotyped as being less-skilled or less-capable than their male counter-parts in our industry. Suggesting those that need help are female is just the thin-end of the wedge on this and may go unnoticed by those using it - a "micro-aggression" as it is now being called - but it…

"Well-accepted" is a bit of a stretch. Maybe increasingly-accepted. Personally I favor the use of the singular they. There's precedent with "you" and it seems mostly preferable to alternatives like he/she or just picking arbitrary genders as was done here.

But I'm also not going to correct someone who doesn't use singular they (unless it's in a situation where they should be following a particular style guide that specifies it).

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#46

Post by [deleted] »

mattlondon wrote: post #42
loco5niner wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An honest attempt to be politically sensitive (say 'she' instead of 'he' sometimes) gets put down for not going far enough. Not helping the cause here.

The point I was trying to make is when referring to unspecified third-persons, dont say "help her". Say "help them". Women are often unfairly stereotyped as being less-skilled or less-capable than their male counter-parts in our industry. Suggesting those that need help are female is just the thin-end of the wedge on this and may go unnoticed by those using it - a "micro-aggression" as it is now being called - but it…

[deleted]

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#48

Post by qwdqwdwqqw »

mattlondon wrote: post #42
loco5niner wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An honest attempt to be politically sensitive (say 'she' instead of 'he' sometimes) gets put down for not going far enough. Not helping the cause here.

The point I was trying to make is when referring to unspecified third-persons, dont say "help her". Say "help them". Women are often unfairly stereotyped as being less-skilled or less-capable than their male counter-parts in our industry. Suggesting those that need help are female is just the thin-end of the wedge on this and may go unnoticed by those using it - a "micro-aggression" as it is now being called - but it…

You mean the webshit industry?

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#49

Post by appleiigs »

bitL wrote: post #11

Technology used to be a bit more immune to cronyism in the past, now it's epidemic for anything above grunt positions - for grunts grueling interviews are in place, for higher ups it's now totally who knows whom and who does something for whom. I want to throw up every time my organization posts a new job position at a higher level and I get bombarded by managers inquiring if their friend or two can't get in there, b…

It'll always move to "who you know" for the most desirable jobs regardless of industry. The top 5-10% are going to look exactly the same when you have a large number of resumes.

Especially very early in the career. A new grad will have top school, top grades, but one will have worked at McDonald's and the other at Burger King, a third at Wendy's. With people looking so similar, you'll need to decide on less meaningful stuff like who's recommended the applicant and trivia questions. One job I applied to had 1000 resumes, interviews for 100, full day interviews for 25, and hired 2. The 2 had family members who were CEO/Chairman level clients to firm.

For tech, there has been amazing amount of entrepreneurship where meritocracy rules, but for the big organizations it will be "who you know".

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#50

Post by ghaff »

antisthenes wrote: post #43
fnbr wrote: post #21

The thing about networking is that good networking is extremely important, but that's not what "Networking" is. In every job I have, I try to grab lunch with people everyday so that I can talk to them and get to know them. I also try to regularly meet new people in my field and get to know them. I've found that to be extremely valuable. However, I've found going to networking events to be an extreme waste of time. Th…

So how does one break out of this catch-22? How do you become a successful professional if you're never given the opportunity to earn trust where it is also visible enough to develop a strong network?

Basically you start with people you interact with naturally and move outward from there. Schoolmates, co-workers, ex-co-workers. Present at events if you can create an opportunity to do so. Blog. And so forth.

It actually seems as if it's much easier today. At my first job in the tech industry, which I had for a long time, there were fewer opportunities to talk about what I was doing outside the company. (Although my next two jobs still came directly from people I met at that company.)

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