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Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

nytimes.com

21–30 of 115 posts

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#21
The thing about networking is that good networking is extremely important, but that's not what "Networking" is.

In every job I have, I try to grab lunch with people everyday so that I can talk to them and get to know them. I also try to regularly meet new people in my field and get to know them. I've found that to be extremely valuable.

However, I've found going to networking events to be an extreme waste of time. The people who go usually aren't the successful professionals, which is who I want to meet. I've found going for drinks with friends- and their friends- to be much more valuable.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#22
Isn't this just math?

Networking is a system for making connections. Desirable connections are relatively rare. The pool of people networking is full of people trying to make desirable connections but has a small amount of people whom are desirable to network with. The more people there are "trying to network," the fewer desirable connections as a percentage of total connections there will be, assuming an even remotely chaotic coupling.

I've met a lot (a lot) of people who I would have no interest networking with. I'm sure for more valuable targets, the number is orders of magnitude higher.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#24

What no one likes to admit is that the benefits of networking are highly dependent on your demographic. Young white dude with excellent credentials? Great! There are plenty of other white dudes who will hear you out. Older lesbian Latina from an unknown school? Not so much. Therefore, if you're more like the Latina and less like the young White dude you should focus on technical ability more and networking less. That…

Being non-default makes someone more memorable. Over time people tend to remember only the good so if you're already memorable for some other reason you need to put less effort into networking.

If people already remember you for whatever reason (like being the old lesbian) then you have to work less hard advertising your value compared to someone else who's not so inherently memorable.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#25
From the article: "It's true that networking can help you accomplish great things. But this obscures the opposite truth: Accomplishing great things help you develop a network."

This is something that I wished I had understood way earlier in my career. Basically that cause and effect are often inverted when people talk about the network effect. People who do some thing well, or are passionate about, often will accumulate a network of others who are interested in that same thing. And because they know a bunch of people who are also interested in that thing, when they hit a roadblock or a problem they have people they can reach out to for help or insights.

What is hard is discovery which is to say that the greatest programmer in the world who sits in his shack and writes perfect code that is beautiful and functional, is invisible.

There is a joke about the guy who complains "I make no money at all from stocks." and the friend says "What stocks do you own?" and the complainer responds "Oh I don't own any stocks, have no use for them, I just want money from them."

Attention and focus is like 'money from stocks' if you share what you're doing and your understanding with people you give them some advantage and perhaps some new understanding. That advantage comes back in the form of referrals or opportunities that you were not present to see when the person you shared with recognizes an opportunity as something you would be interested in. It also allows you to be "discovered" two or three hops down the road when someone says "Oh I know someone who is interested in that ..."

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#26
The article gives example of Justin Bieber and Adele. For those two examples, there are hundreds who got where they are just because they knew someone important. Miley Cyrus, Jaden Smith, Charlie Sheen, Ben Stiller, Angelina Jolie, Paris Hilton. Actors/singers make very poor examples for this given that most of them mostly get to where they are by networking more than anything else.

Lets say there was an absolute master of his profession that nobody knows. Compare that to someone who knows enough to get by when it comes to his profession but knows most people there is to know in the industry. In general, which one is more likely to get hired? Who will have better references? Who is likely to know about vacancies before they are announced? Are companies willing to hire someone because he answered more question in a test even vs who did OK but has a lot of good references from respectable people, some of whom they personally know?

Someone who only cares about a better paying job should spend 90% of their time in networking and 10% on honing their profession because networking is all that matters. Someone who absolutely loves their work will happily do their share of work for a lower pay.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#27
post #11

Technology used to be a bit more immune to cronyism in the past, now it's epidemic for anything above grunt positions - for grunts grueling interviews are in place, for higher ups it's now totally who knows whom and who does something for whom. I want to throw up every time my organization posts a new job position at a higher level and I get bombarded by managers inquiring if their friend or two can't get in there, b…

Its not about what you know.

Its not about who you know either.

Its about whom you can trust to solve problems and decide wisely -- It always has been and until there is a clearly rational way to evaluate trustworthiness to do an ambiguous job, it always will be.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#28
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps. But you should experience some of the "networking" advice that is foisted on the average job-seeker, fresh out of college or otherwise. One reason it is difficult for some people; it reeks of superficiality if not insincerity.

Yeah, there are explicit "networking events," which are generally horrible because there's no subtlety to them. Then there's tech meetups or conferences, where you and I might nerd out over common problems we've had to solve, and in the process realise that we might enjoy working with the other person. The thing is, one has to put in the work and put themself out there. Luck is what happens when preparation meets opp…

Yes. But college/university career counseling staffs and unemployment bureaus of various sorts and the like leave a lot of people with an early, negative impression of networking.

People who may have had a lot of opportunity in their life/careers and who tend to fall into productive and interesting networking scenarios, should at least know that for a lot of the... well, I can really only speak for the U.S.... by dint of experience, "networking" -- at least as a formal and promoted activity -- is a dirty word.

And having quickly looked at the OP story, I also recall some very uncomfortable feelings, watching someone aggressively pursue a senior executive's email or phone number. E.g. this fellow or gal comes to a friend's purely social event, and ends up having to handle undesired and poorly couched attempts at professional connections.

And the few times I've been talked into attempting to "work the system" in such a fashion? Still make me shudder.

P.S. Or the person who's picked up their license as a mortgage broker, and the conversations you attempt to dance around whenever your own looming home purchase comes up. And...

Even at the everyday level, a side of "networking" that's kind of a pain to deal with.

Anyway... I mostly agree with the article. Have something they're genuinely interested in.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#29
I hope all my competition believes as much.

I can't tell if the author has identified a straw man or a weak man, but I don't think serious, accomplished people give out the advice that successful networking = acting like a pest and creating hollow relationships.

Maybe we need a better way to describe networking, right now we use the same work to describe establishing credibility and rapport with like minded people and attempting to become a barnacle / remora on a successful person.

I don't know if I've ever consciously networked, but seeking out like-minded people and engaging them with interesting discussion / ideas has served me well. Though I work in a technical capacity and it does seem as though people-management is qualitatively different but not completely divorced.

I've seen talentless hacks rise up (or fail up?) but the success was never sustainable and for some reason, all those people never saved enough money for the inevitable rainy day: they blow something up or lose a game of executive musical chairs, leave, and can't swindle their way into a comparable job.

However, it's been my experience that the vast majority of executives who have held onto their executive position for longer than 2 power struggles are very deserving of the position. Sure, a lot of them let off the gas relative to the performance that got them into their role. But they're extraordinarily capable people.

The only way to really sustain positive career trajectory is through accomplishment (and unfortunately, accomplishment isn't a guarantee of a successful career). And if you can't do that, you have to skate by on 'luck'.

Cronyism seems to ebb and flow, I think there's a lot of it right now because most businesses aren't that competitive. But if we get some creative destruction going, we'll see the balance of power shift more decisively towards makers and doers.

One trend that I've seen in the past 3 years that I like a lot is more salary growth opportunity for technical employees. 5 years ago, I saw a lot of companies stall people out, "if you want to make more money you have to become a manager". But a lot of companies lost a lot of talent and now they're correcting their dumb policy.

How is this related to network? It's just a consideration and optimization problem (and maybe a problem that maps well to your sociability) but networking shouldn't be a 4 letter word. If you're not enjoying it, you'll probably be well-rewarded to find a way to make it more enjoyable and that's pretty easy if you enjoy some element of your profession.

I'm reminded of The Last Psychiatrist's article, "This Is Why The American Dream Is Out Of Reach". It's also about a NYT article.

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/08/this_is_why_the_ameri...

there's a deeper problem: people see personal connections and favors as key path to prosperity. Sure, they help. But the most lucrative opportunities aren't the chance to meet someone important, the most lucrative opportunities are those that involve solving a problem. How much time do parasites put into networking? I bet it's more time than they put into starting a new business or doing something.

Re: Good News for Young Strivers: Networking Is Overrated

#30
From the world of politics, and government relations, it is nearly impossible to get anything done, or rapid career advancement (save getting elected to public office) without networking. My world is built on who you know, and being able to reach other people you don't know when you need to.
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