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“Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

nytimes.com

181–190 of 196 posts

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#181
post #9

Took the course. A lot of it is cruft and motivation for the underlying core ideas. The techniques suggested are things many people are already familiar with: recall, deliberate practice, interleaving, spaced repetition, Einstellung, Pomodoro, Feynman Method, Cornell notes or similar (to force recall), exercise regularly, sleep well, focus on concepts not facts (chunking), etc. A composite of these dramatically enhan…

Chunking is most definitely not "focus on concept not facts."

Yeah I used to remember it being slang for chatting in the BBS (multinode e.g. Wildcat) days because of the loud "chunk" (or clunk) sound of keyboards in the 90s.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#182
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've spent a lot of time digging through the major works of post enlightenment philosophers. Even fairly "concise" (by the standards of the day) writers like Hume, Nietzsche and Bertrand Russell belabor points far beyond what was necessary for me to apprehend their meaning. I'm of the opinion that if you have to be "trained" to find a work aesthetically appealing, it isn't inherently aesthetic. By analogy, some women…

> I'm of the opinion that if you have to be "trained" to find a work aesthetically appealing, it isn't inherently aesthetic. I don't see how this is tenable, given how much aesthetic taste is learned regardless. A lifetime's journey through arts, if done with any thought at all, is certainly a process of learning, of training. Efforts to defend old favorites in light of new knowledge will be attempted, sometimes succ…

I wasn't speaking of fiction in my original post. The purpose of fiction is to create an experience in the mind of the reader rather than to convey information. As such, you can't judge a work by an absolute standard, really the only measure of success is how well the writing tends to induce the experience the author intended. This of course will depend on how well the author has anticipated the mind of the reader.

It is true that no preferences exist free of introduced bias. My problem is mainly with things that people train themselves to like in order to appear "sophisticated". It's like an arms race, where people learn to like progressively less pleasant things in order to differentiate themselves. Everyone would be happier if we collectively said "screw sophistication" but nobody wants to be the first person to appear "boorish".

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#183
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> A lot of it is cruft and motivation for the underlying core ideas. Someone else made the exact same remark about Cal Newport's book "Deep Work" earlier this week in another thread. I find this to be true about a lot of books/courses/content of a "self-help" nature that are designed to be practical and applicable - the real helpful stuff boiled down to its essence could fit in a tri-fold pamphlet (or a 350-line pas…

Agreed. There's a serious problem of information density in content these days. Most publisher-driven content is almost intentionally sparse. It takes tremendous expertise to weld information with context in a way that doesn't feel hollow and commercial. Two books I've come across recently that do well to circumvent that problem: Sapiens by Yuval Harari and Designing Data-Intensive Applications by Martin Kleppmann. I…

Is it possible that the problem isn't publishers or authors, but rather readers and people in general?

I know a retired journalist who worked for 20 something years. When started articles and film pieces used a strategy of jamming as much information in as densely as possible. Towards the end of his career the strategy was making the message as clear as possible so that a few facts could be conveyed accurately and meaningfully.

The average person just isn't ready for dense facts outside their expertise. Things like repetition, dilution and numerous examples make internalizing external information easier.

As a programmer you are probably already an expert at self directed learning and find that method simplistic. How would you want to approach a topic you were inexpert at not planning on pursuing professionally?

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've spent a lot of time digging through the major works of post enlightenment philosophers. Even fairly "concise" (by the standards of the day) writers like Hume, Nietzsche and Bertrand Russell belabor points far beyond what was necessary for me to apprehend their meaning. I'm of the opinion that if you have to be "trained" to find a work aesthetically appealing, it isn't inherently aesthetic. By analogy, some women…

Minus the weird and out-of-place analogy about sexual role playing and bdsm, this kinda sounds like a child talking about the bitter taste of coffee or beer, when soda is so much sweeter.

Is the child wrong?

Why or why Not?

Things like taste are subjective. I am thirty something and don't like the majority of coffee and I don't drink beer or wine at all. I had a Mexican Coke (so much better than normal coke) in preference to bitter coffee this morning. Does that make me childish?

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#185
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm of the opinion that if you have to be "trained" to find a work aesthetically appealing, it isn't inherently aesthetic. I don't see how this is tenable, given how much aesthetic taste is learned regardless. A lifetime's journey through arts, if done with any thought at all, is certainly a process of learning, of training. Efforts to defend old favorites in light of new knowledge will be attempted, sometimes succ…

I wasn't speaking of fiction in my original post. The purpose of fiction is to create an experience in the mind of the reader rather than to convey information. As such, you can't judge a work by an absolute standard, really the only measure of success is how well the writing tends to induce the experience the author intended. This of course will depend on how well the author has anticipated the mind of the reader. I…

> I wasn't speaking of fiction in my original post. The purpose of fiction is to create an experience in the mind of the reader rather than to convey information. As such, you can't judge a work by an absolute standard, really the only measure of success is how well the writing tends to induce the experience the author intended. This of course will depend on how well the author has anticipated the mind of the reader.

Ah, I misunderstood. I agree with you that redundancy is a common problem even in "good" works of non-fiction, though I think it's sometimes a sign that one has approached a work too late, not that the work is generally poor. I found the oft-recommended A Demon-Haunted World, for instance, to be an over-long, dull, repetitive, low-value work... but if I'd read it when I was 14? Who knows. Judging from others' testimonies I suspect I'd not have had the same complaints if I'd read it at a different time in my life.

Full-on self-help books—to include pop-business books—I would exempt from this cautious judgement, since useless padding is practically a codified, defining property of the genre.

> It is true that no preferences exist free of introduced bias. My problem is mainly with things that people train themselves to like in order to appear "sophisticated". It's like an arms race, where people learn to like progressively less pleasant things in order to differentiate themselves. Everyone would be happier if we collectively said "screw sophistication" but nobody wants to be the first person to appear "boorish".

Absolutely a problem. Humility, compassion, restraint, self-awareness, and plain speaking are everywhere in short supply.

[EDIT] looking back, I think I took your words "the 'classics' of western literature" more broadly than you intended them, i.e. to include fiction, verse, et c.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#186
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chunking is most definitely not "focus on concept not facts."

Yes, that was misstated. What I meant was that chunking is a realization of the principle of focusing on concepts instead of facts since chunks are the residual output of knowledge acquisition that actually sticks in the long term.

Maybe I misunderstood chunking when I watched the class. I took it to mean grouping items to remember into a larger whole. Orthogonal to concept vs fact.

I can remember my credit card numbers because I have chunked the digits into a whole. Or at least that's what I thought was meant by chunking.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#187
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that was misstated. What I meant was that chunking is a realization of the principle of focusing on concepts instead of facts since chunks are the residual output of knowledge acquisition that actually sticks in the long term.

Maybe I misunderstood chunking when I watched the class. I took it to mean grouping items to remember into a larger whole. Orthogonal to concept vs fact. I can remember my credit card numbers because I have chunked the digits into a whole. Or at least that's what I thought was meant by chunking.

Now that I've been reflecting on it, I seem to recall what you are talking about. Stepping up the ladder of abstraction...

Sorry, it's been a while since I watched it.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a brief perusal of the article, there doesn't appear to be much point to the sentence you quote. It's irrelevant at best and, yes, rude at worst. I'm a cat owner; if I or any of my cat owning peers were told our homes smelled, we would be embarrassed.

Honest question. If it really smelt, would you still be offended? I am genuinely curious. I watched Bill Burr stand up comedy routine recently and he touches upon a similar topic. Though its comedy, I thought he made a good point - shame is a valid human emotion, why are we as a society so against feeling it, even when it is justified.

I wouldn't be offended at all. If the person decided to announce to the world that my home smelt like cat piss, though, it'd be a different story.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#189
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. There's a serious problem of information density in content these days. Most publisher-driven content is almost intentionally sparse. It takes tremendous expertise to weld information with context in a way that doesn't feel hollow and commercial. Two books I've come across recently that do well to circumvent that problem: Sapiens by Yuval Harari and Designing Data-Intensive Applications by Martin Kleppmann. I…

The problem of low information density isn't new. Most of the "classics" of western literature have the same problem. We're just more attuned to it now because we've been trained by internet articles to expect an idea to be introduced, explored and concluded in 1000-2000 words. Beyond that, these days many people won't even bother with that if there isn't a quick hook or a TL;DR that sucks them into reading further.

I think this describes a different problem. Sure, people are trained to consume small chunks now - but much of that 1000-2000 word content is also information-light.

Re: “Learning How to Learn,” the most popular course on Coursera

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The techniques suggested are things many people are already familiar with [...] And you then list 11 concepts, 5 of which I'd never heard of before I took this course, 3 more which I had not associated with aiding learning and the remaining 3 not being sufficient to help me learn more. Your tone is unhelpful, elitist and snobby. This course is extremely useful to a lot of people - there is a reason it's popular, a…

Nothing wrong with his comment. Yours is rude.

The original comment is condescending, and is not unusual on HN. To call that out is not rude.
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