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Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

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Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#211

Post by the_stc »

vkou wrote: post #158
the_stc wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely not sarcasm. Why would ICOs giving out tokens with no equity be superior to a tokens that have equity and receive dividends?

If you sell equity, and will pay dividends, why not just do an IPO? The SEC will treat you as a security anyways.

We're doing a blockchain IPO because the subject we deal with has significant legal issues in most countries (details in profile). We're operating as an extrajurisdictional company to get around these issues, with an anonymous founding and executive team.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#212

Post by bandrami »

literallycancer wrote: post #210
bandrami wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or correctly, in the sense of "a system that requires constant new investment to achieve payouts"

Kind of like pension systems in most countries?

Largely, which is why we keep reminding people they are social insurance programs, not investments. The state has guns, and can mandate the continued investment

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#213

Post by richardknop »

tansha_x wrote: post #128
richardknop wrote: post #17

Another ICO, another scam. I am not sure I feel bad for people who are gullible enough to send their hard earned money to these "companies". They have one PDF whitepaper and a generic Wordpress template website with some buzzwords, based in Cayman islands or some other tax haven for money laundering. And expecting to get rich from that.

and just look at the list of ongoing ICOs https://www.coingecko.com/ico Not to mentioned those that have secured investments...

This is so crazy. I am increasingly hearing random non tech people talking about buying bitcoins or other tokens and imagining how they will get rich in a year when price keeps multiplying. I wonder how long can this mass frenzy go on.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#214

Post by bandrami »

SippinLean wrote: post #209
bandrami wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or correctly, in the sense of "a system that requires constant new investment to achieve payouts"

If you think that's all it takes to satisfy the definition of a Ponzi scheme, you're incorrect. That would even be an oversimplification for a Pyramid scheme. I'm not sure why this has to be corrected for every crypto thread on HN. We get it, someone has to comment on every crypto post "Ponzi scheme," "tulips," or the like (regardless on whether or not such a generic comment is especially relevant to the thread) but…

Equally, "your side" could save a lot of time by saying "This asset bubble is different" and leaving it at that.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#215

Post by whipoodle »

CryptoPunk wrote: post #190

HackerNews gets an unrepresentative picture of the token market. The only stories that get to the frontpage are the ones concerning hacks. But that's not the whole picture. There are a huge number of token sales happening, and the vast majority are not being hacked. This is certainly newsworthy but it needs to be put into the context of how many token sales occur.

OK, but there are a lot of these. I get that it's not all of them, but the ratio has got to be terrible.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#216

Post by nxsynonym »

jethro_tell wrote: post #146
nxsynonym wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are afraid of missing the next Bitcoin boom and think throwing money at every ICO will turn them into overnight millionaires. It's unfortunate that the greed and FOMO are dragging the technology through the dirt. If you plan on investing in any ICO please do your due diligence and avoid the hype trains.

I also know a bunch of guys who sit around, smoke cigars and take side bets on the ICO Gambles they are taking. It's just straight gambling to some people.

As far as gambling goes it's probably one of the more fun ways to spend the money - instead of camping out at a blackjack table some would rather watch the 24 price changes.

Which is fine if you have the money to spend (waste). But people are getting sold on it like a penny-stock scheme straight out of Wolf of Wall Street.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#217

Post by arkitaip »

KGIII wrote: post #123
richman777 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Need an advisor?

Right? I do have a Ph.D. from MIT, even. I'd advise them to incorporate their PDF, and perhaps lesson taker's info, into a blockchain.

downloading adobe acrobat as we speak. is there like a blockchain addon that launches my ico? kthxbye

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#218

Post by vkou »

omarchowdhury wrote: post #205
vkou wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Employees and founders typically can't sell shares (Except to the VCs, at a price the VCs set) until the company goes public, or is wildly successful. They do get paid salaries, but undergo audits... To make sure that the 10 million dollar round didn't go straight to the CTO's Bahaman yaht fund. These audits are typically not done by the founders. With an ICO, all bets are off. There's no reporting requirements, the…

You seem to be positing an absolute: that an ICO can't behave transparently by nature. Which isn't true. ICO and transparency aren't mutually exclusive.

No, but there's a huge difference in the amount of oversight token holders have on an ICO, and the amount of oversight that VCs have on a startup.

It's certainly possible to structure an ICO in such a way that token holders will get board seats, proper auditing, etc, but I've yet to see one that is.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#219

Post by vkou »

the_stc wrote: post #211
vkou wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you sell equity, and will pay dividends, why not just do an IPO? The SEC will treat you as a security anyways.

We're doing a blockchain IPO because the subject we deal with has significant legal issues in most countries (details in profile). We're operating as an extrajurisdictional company to get around these issues, with an anonymous founding and executive team.

Oh, right, I recall your earlier posts on this subject. That's a fair use case, although it is also fraught with legal perils.

Re: Hackers nab $500k as Enigma is compromised weeks before its ICO

#220

Post by pavel_lishin »

ringaroundthetx wrote: post #178
pavel_lishin wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the team and organization gets funded, the buyers are liquid, nobody makes ridiculous decisions counter to their dreams hoping for "an exit", because everyone already has one. Can you expand on this? What do you mean by "everyone already has one" in this scenario?

Okay, in startups, corporations are formed and the equity (shares) in the corporation are doled out as currency. Completely useless currency given to helpers under the idea that they'll get rich one day in very improbable scenarios. There is no legal way to sell the shares (hyperbole, but very many hurdles). And exchanging additional shares for cash investments only serves to make your non-sellable stake in the compa…

Isn't this a bit of a Chesterton's Fence situation? There must be reasons other than "VCs are greedy!" for employees not being able to sell off their stocks immediately.

The most obvious way to abuse this would be to join or create a startup, go through the ICO process, then sell off your shares, and, well, exit. Leave the company. You're rich, now - why keep working to build the product you (or your boss) promised to deliver?

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