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Is the open office layout dead?

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Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#301

Post by rayiner »

paulsutter wrote: post #197
rayiner wrote: post #123

I've never understood the price issue. Class A in midtown Manhattan is $80 per square foot. That's $8,000 per year for a developer that probably makes well over six figures. Put two in an office that's only $4,000 per year. I really don't buy it considering how much money companies spend on office space. Like why he hell would you have offices in Greenwich Village ( http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-new-york-of…

Law firms are relatively static sized, sign leases of epic duration, and can thus remodel. Startups need to move once a year because they're growing and they keep filling up their space. When you move once a year you're really looking for a sublet, probably already furnished, and choosing from what's on the market. So at the core, the cause of open floor plans is too many open floor plans. And the more people that sw…

I totally get that there are non-cost reasons, like being able to rapidly expand. I was addressing just the "cost per person" angle. (I basically worked in that scenario before. We started with our own offices, then as we grew we reconfigured to space into large rooms with 4-6 cubes. It worked okay, especially because starting with individual offices enforced a "quiet" culture.)

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#302

Post by PeterisP »

mixedCase wrote: post #9
banach wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how you classify "space to get into the zone" as an employee benefit, while all that does is increase your productivity. But I guess that could mean going home earlier...

It's an employee benefit because it makes work more enjoyable. Being stuck in a problem that you can normally tackle with relative ease when "in the zone" is extremely frustrating.

Sure, but to the employer the primary benefit of this is that people don't get stuck in problems that they can normally tackle with relative ease; the main effect (to the employer) is the fact that they're much more productive, not that they're a bit more happier.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#303

Post by basseq »

nerdponx wrote: post #286

No designated desks. Please please please no. Having "personal" space at the office is just as important as having "quiet" space. I do not want to feel like a drifter, a student in the library, or a tenant in a co-working space, unless I am actually one of those things.

I worked in a "hoteling" environment as a consultant for more than a year, so let me tell you what happens when there are no designated desks:

There are designated desks. It turns into high school lunch hour, where everyone has "their seat" and god forbid the ignoramus who trespasses.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#304

Post by rb808 »

rayiner wrote: post #123

I've never understood the price issue. Class A in midtown Manhattan is $80 per square foot. That's $8,000 per year for a developer that probably makes well over six figures. Put two in an office that's only $4,000 per year. I really don't buy it considering how much money companies spend on office space. Like why he hell would you have offices in Greenwich Village ( http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-new-york-of…

10 sq ft/person really? :) make sure to include space for luxuries like hallways and bathrooms, as well as meeting rooms, printers, cupboards etc.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#305

Post by noxToken »

curun1r wrote: post #203
northwest65 wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would really encourage you to move on the interviewing as soon as you can. I was in your position, desperately unhappy with the working conditions, and now I'm in a small quiet office with 4 to 5 other people and I have never been happier in my work. In the meantime, get yourself a set of Bose Quiet Comfort 35s. An absolutely life changing piece of equipment for me at least. If nothing else you will comfortable enj…

> get yourself a set of Bose Quiet Comfort 35s That's only if you like to listen to music while you work. If you just want quiet, get yourself a pair of the earmuffs that the airport ground crews wear out on the tarmac. I had a coworker who wore those and the only real downside was that he'd get horribly startled when people were trying to get his attention because they'd have to come up and touch him on the shoulder…

Can't you just use a pair of noise-canceling cans without piping audio through them? Is there a drawback to turning on the noise-canceling feature without coming through the speakers? It won't be completely quiet (on basic models), but it is probably comfortably quiet for most.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#306

Post by falcolas »

basseq wrote: post #303
nerdponx wrote: post #286

No designated desks. Please please please no. Having "personal" space at the office is just as important as having "quiet" space. I do not want to feel like a drifter, a student in the library, or a tenant in a co-working space, unless I am actually one of those things.

I worked in a "hoteling" environment as a consultant for more than a year, so let me tell you what happens when there are no designated desks: There are designated desks. It turns into high school lunch hour, where everyone has "their seat" and god forbid the ignoramus who trespasses.

Until someone more senior than you comes along and takes your seat. Typically someone from outside the office who just wants to sit next to their "friends". Nothing quite reminds you how junior you are than to have to find another desk.

It's another one of those "wins" for the corporation - why set up guest stations throughout the business when you can just say "there are no assigned desks"? It even re-inforces the "we are a family, not a company" meme.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#307

Post by gruturo »

sogen wrote: post #221
mc32 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cubicles were maligned as passé ("cubicle farms") and staid so that managers and facilities could present open office spaces as au courant, forward and entrepreneurial so that in turn they could save in area per employee expenses. If they can call cubicles "farms" (echoing sharecropping, drudgery), then we could just as easily and aptly call open office layouts "sardine cans" with all the earned baggage that comes wi…

Some ideas: "Open cans" "Sweat farms" "Sweat cans" "Headphones farms"

Chicken farms. Don't forget to cluck regularly.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#308

Post by Ndymium »

I wonder why so few are talking about the in-between. There seems to be only open offices or everyone has their private room. The first is my personal nightmare, the second is very expensive and hinders quick collaboration with colleagues.

At my workplace we have a mix of both. We have project rooms (my current one has 6 people) where people are working on the same or similar things. This keeps the noise and visual distractions to a minimum (we have small cubicle-like walls attached to our desks that rise with the desk if you raise it up) while still allowing us to ask the quick question or look at things together if required (of course you need to limit that so that you don't bug them all the time). In my experience this is the best compromise if you are working in a project with a few other people.

The removal of personal desks would be terrible IMO. Many people have said they just like having a desk, but I also have notepads, things attached to the desk "walls", stuff for fidgeting when I'm thinking, 2 monitors attached to my laptop, keyboard, mouse, headphones... I can take my laptop to go sit wherever else, but why would I? I would have to carry around so much stuff or forgo these productivity tools I have. Sometimes I do write with just my laptop in the common areas somewhere, but it's only for a short while. Sure, you could put standardised desks everywhere with the same setup, but then it would probably not match _my_ preferences anymore and thus would be worse for my working.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#309

Post by falcolas »

rb808 wrote: post #304
rayiner wrote: post #123

I've never understood the price issue. Class A in midtown Manhattan is $80 per square foot. That's $8,000 per year for a developer that probably makes well over six figures. Put two in an office that's only $4,000 per year. I really don't buy it considering how much money companies spend on office space. Like why he hell would you have offices in Greenwich Village ( http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-new-york-of…

10 sq ft/person really? :) make sure to include space for luxuries like hallways and bathrooms, as well as meeting rooms, printers, cupboards etc.

Even at 10 times that (a bit larger than a "middle manager office") the price isn't that bad.

Especially when you consider the base square footage per person in an open office plan is around 60 square feet.

Re: Is the open office layout dead?

#310

Post by athenot »

I think it depends a lot on the culture of the organization. Currently my team is highly distributed and my local colleages only meet in person in the office about twice a week, with the support from the very top of our BU. In our case, I feel that having my own space that sits empty 5 days out of 7 is highly wasteful. Currently my own desk is spartan: 2 monitors and the necessary cables; that's it.

When working from home becomes the norm, I think change in the office setup is inevitable and I welcome that tradeoff. I would love a modern shared desk setup, as long as all of desks have good monitors to go with them. Heck, group them in pods of 4/8/12 desks and make them bookable just like conference rooms (but for a day).

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