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Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

nytimes.com

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Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#111

Post by dredmorbius »

mrep wrote: post #51
lsc wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an argument that the problems people see with both 'real wage stagnation' and 'increased divorce rates' are really problems caused by measuring the wrong thing. The argument is quite clear when it comes to the divorce rate; Being alone, if financially tenable, is better than being in a bad relationship, so if you make being alone financially tenable for another half of the population, divorce rates will go u…

> women on average make less than men, and thus you will get a lower rate for 'average worker' than for 'average male worker' - even today I've also heard that is attributable to woman having to bear the brunt of childbirth.

A case of strongly-established gender-related differential in labour effectiveness.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#112

Post by dredmorbius »

mrep wrote: post #51
lsc wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an argument that the problems people see with both 'real wage stagnation' and 'increased divorce rates' are really problems caused by measuring the wrong thing. The argument is quite clear when it comes to the divorce rate; Being alone, if financially tenable, is better than being in a bad relationship, so if you make being alone financially tenable for another half of the population, divorce rates will go u…

> women on average make less than men, and thus you will get a lower rate for 'average worker' than for 'average male worker' - even today I've also heard that is attributable to woman having to bear the brunt of childbirth.

A case of strongly-established gender-related differential in labour effectiveness.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#113

Post by ge96 »

Man that's messed up about the plastic. Everytime I heat up food in plastic now at my job I will think some guy out there I'm killing his sperm. Ahh the sugar too man... Alright will try to keep that in mind when eating/shopping.

Soda though, it's what keeps me awake/engaged at work, coke it's nasty as hell but... There is also unsweetened tea, I don't know if it's too strong, seems to have the opposite effect of feeling more alert. Often I go to work without sleep but that's my own problem, that's why I look forward to being self employed haha.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#114

Post by lsc »

rtpg wrote: post #52
lsc wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an argument that the problems people see with both 'real wage stagnation' and 'increased divorce rates' are really problems caused by measuring the wrong thing. The argument is quite clear when it comes to the divorce rate; Being alone, if financially tenable, is better than being in a bad relationship, so if you make being alone financially tenable for another half of the population, divorce rates will go u…

RE your second argument: population increases have always been happening, so why would it only be from the 70s that it would finally depress wage growth?

Yup, that's why I was saying that it's a much weaker argument, because it is a much weaker argument.

If I was going to add more evidence for that argument, I would point out that women were added to the workforce at a rate that is greater than what population growth usually is, but certainly, there is a good case to be made that adding more workers doesn't always push down wages.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#115

Post by AstralStorm »

Tharkun wrote: post #99
narrator wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's funny is the guy who discovered BPA was an estrogen mimicking chemical[1] kept having his estrogen sensitive cells triggered whenever he would put them in plastic test tubes. He called up Corning to ask them what the test tubes were made of and they told him they don't give that info out. So all this lab equipment and stuff that they use to feed animals and all up and down the food supply chain is probably ful…

That's crazy. I wonder if this also has an impact on hospital patients being tube fed!

Probably not as bad, PVC tubing uses different plasticizers, silicone does not need that. However, other hardware is not of the hook (e.g. plastic bags) and what they use in these materials as well.

The most terrible thing is that this might be partly heritable via epigenetics.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#116

Post by AstralStorm »

adrianN wrote: post #92
teekert wrote: post #45

Quote from article (meant as response to AndrewKemendo): "Phthalates are a group of chemicals used to make plastics more flexible and harder to break. In several studies over the last two decades, they have been shown to disrupt the operation of male hormones like testosterone and have been linked to genital birth defects in male infants. Dr. Swan, who conducted a 2008 study about phthalate exposure, said that scient…

Another problem is that if you ban BPA you have to replace it with something else that makes plastics less brittle. It's completely unclear whether the replacement chemical will be better or worse. Almost all chemicals we use industrially are untested.

Albeit if you do not need durability or huge oil resistance you can go very far with silicone tubing which does not need plasticizers. Nobody likes the expense or maintenance though.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#117

Post by AstralStorm »

Tharkun wrote: post #103
cameldrv wrote: post #88

I think it's pretty clear that Phthalates are a big piece of the puzzle. Here's the chain of evidence: I just picked one study for every link, but there are many for each. People have significant levels of Phthalates in their blood: http://www.ourstolenfuture.org/NewScience/oncompounds/phthal... People who have higher levels of Phthalates in their blood tend to have lower testosterone: http://www.medscape.com/viewart…

Have there been any studies on how to reduce phthalate levels in humans? Does limiting exposure help? Can the body expell the stuff?

1) pilot studies.

2) it is very hard to limit exposure, they're too widespread. The main effects happen in childhood and adolescence. They may last for life.

3) not clear and not studied, but likely yes. This might not help at all like with many endocrine toxins that act on development.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#118

Post by lsc »

mrep wrote: post #51
lsc wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an argument that the problems people see with both 'real wage stagnation' and 'increased divorce rates' are really problems caused by measuring the wrong thing. The argument is quite clear when it comes to the divorce rate; Being alone, if financially tenable, is better than being in a bad relationship, so if you make being alone financially tenable for another half of the population, divorce rates will go u…

> women on average make less than men, and thus you will get a lower rate for 'average worker' than for 'average male worker' - even today I've also heard that is attributable to woman having to bear the brunt of childbirth.

the reason is not particularly relevant to the point I was making; Just to be clear, I disagree with your assessment of the reasons for the disparity in pay, my own life experiences and education cause me to assign the disparity largely to irrational bias, but certainly I don't know of any good evidence either way.

I'm just saying that whatever the reason for the disparity in pay, adding a group of workers who make less to the average is going to push down that average.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#119

Post by AstralStorm »

azr79 wrote: post #100
PrimHelios wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>birth control/estrogen in water Is that actually a thing? I didn't find any sources definitively showing it was enough to warrant a concern.

women take birth control they pee and flush this water gets processed and re injected back into the pipes if you make the mistake to drink the tap water where they re purpose it from the canalisations, you just drink birth control water.

Data to back it up please? As far as I know the hormones used have quite short half life in decent conditions. Much less metabolites.

Re: Sperm Count in Western Men Has Dropped Over 50 Percent Since 1973, Paper Finds

#120

Post by AstralStorm »

pasquinelli wrote: post #91
whizzkid wrote: post #78

My theory goes like this; > In the recently released research, no significant decline in sperm quality was seen in men from non-Western countries, but this segment made up only about a quarter of the results. There is something in developed countries that the male do not experience during his lifetime. It can be lack of fear, adrenalin, less activity, or something else. I think statistics hold up with the historic wa…

that sounds magical.

It is easily testable. Take samples of war veterans.
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