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Vue.js vs. React

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Re: Vue.js vs. React

#191

Post by pier25 »

ng12 wrote: post #179
pier25 wrote: post #132

We moved away from React to Vue about 8 months ago and everyone on the team is a lot happier. First reason is we hate JSX. It forces you to write loops, conditionals, etc, outside of the markup you are currently writing/reading. It's like writing shitty PHP code without templates. It also forces you to use a lot of boilerplate like bind(), Object.keys(), etc. Another problem with React is that it only really solves o…

> It forces you to write loops, conditionals, etc, outside of the markup you are currently writing/reading What does this mean? I have a sneaking suspicion this is a symptom of poor separation of concerns.

It means that you can't loop where you actually need that loop and that makes reading and writing markup harder than it needs to be.

https://facebook.github.io/react/docs/lists-and-keys.html

Since JSX mixes logic and markup indistinguishably I'd say that's where the poor separation of concerns really is.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#192

Post by davedx »

a13n wrote: post #46

You'll see quotes in this thread like "The demand for both React and Vue.js is growing tremendously" thrown around. It's good to check out npm install stats to get an unopinionated comparison. https://npm-stat.com/charts.html?package=react&package=vue&p... In reality, React is downloaded roughly 4-5x more than angular and 7-8x more than Vue. In August so far, React has 75% market share among these three libs. Interes…

Indeed. There is a lot of hype around vue.js, and maybe some is even warranted, but companies and devs are almost entirely split between Angular2 and React in my experience (been hiring, so reading lots of CVs and talking to devs).

Vue.js might be better than React in some ways, but is it enough of a paradigm shift to throw away a bunch of hard earned knowledge?

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#193

Post by Andrex »

noir_lord wrote: post #122
ergo14 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now a great option with "forward-compatible" applications would be to go Polymer.

I saw a talk on Polymer about 2 years ago where it was the next big thing, here we are two years later and it doesn't seem to have progressed at all - I do get that it is the future I just don't think it's one that's quite ready yet.

The update from Polymer 1 (Web Components v0) to Polymer 2 (Web Components v1) was huge for both code simplicity and performance. I know that my huge hangup with Polymer was performance, but it was solved (mostly) by Polymer 2 (released last May.) I'd give it a second look, especially now that most of the major pieces of Web Components v1 are shipping natively in browsers.

On the other hand, a lighter Web Components library I've been looking at has been Xtag.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#194

Post by Bahamut »

eibrahim wrote: post #176
Kiro wrote: post #108

I've built semi-large applications in both Vue.js and React. I like both but prefer React. For me Vue.js is like a light-weight Angular 1, in a good way. It's very intuitive and you can start working immediately. It does however easily end up in confusion about where the state lives with the two-way binding. I've run into a lot of implicit state changes wrecking havoc. The declarative nature of React definitely wins…

I have been building web apps for 19+ years. I like many of the frameworks out there but for some reason I HATE React. I think JSX is a huge turnoff for me. I just can't get past html in javascript. It feels wrong. With that said, there are so many VERY smart people embracing React, so I am always questioning my "hate". Maybe one day I will change my mind. I haven't use Vue but watched/read about it and seems very co…

Interestingly, I had recently joined a team that was using Ember, and we found that Ember hampered our productivity. We switched to React and was able to rebuild 4 months of Ember work in about 3 weeks of work in React (not sure how many developers were working on the Ember app originally, but it was mainly 2 of us who built the React app), including requisite tests.

I’m of the opinion that Angular is much better than Ember (note: I have 4.5 years of experience in the Angular ecosystem, including in open source), and I think I am overall perhaps more productive with React than Angular, although I feel like there are less issues with state management in Angular, which has been a pita in React. All the libraries/frameworks have various tradeoffs ultimately, so I don’t believe there is a cure all for everyone’s preferences.

A note about JSX - I am not a big fan of it, but I see it more as having tradeoffs like more traditional templating languages, but different ones. I have been a bit resigned that this is the direction the ecosystem has turned towards, so I have personally decided to hold that dislike more loosely and focus on more important architecture issues. It does little good to let dislike over style paper over higher level issues if you can help it IMO. I don’t think we’ll ever see a perfect template language.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#195

Post by idibidiart »

I have to many points associated with this handle. I'd like a 100 or so shaved off

React is for CS-savvy programmers. Vue is for those who like to think of themselves as programmers.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#196

Post by thomasDE »

pier25 wrote: post #132

We moved away from React to Vue about 8 months ago and everyone on the team is a lot happier. First reason is we hate JSX. It forces you to write loops, conditionals, etc, outside of the markup you are currently writing/reading. It's like writing shitty PHP code without templates. It also forces you to use a lot of boilerplate like bind(), Object.keys(), etc. Another problem with React is that it only really solves o…

> It's like writing shitty PHP code without templates.

For me, it's the other way around. I feel like you can still separate the logic and markup, but instead of the template engine syntax you can just JavaScript.

From the top of my head, I can at least remember six template engines' syntax I've learned: Smarty (PHP), Mustache, Blade (PHP), EJS, Angular and another custom template engine. When I tried React I was so happy that I did not have to learn another template syntax as it all was just JavaScript.

Another template engine syntax? No, thank you. I stick to React.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#197

Post by Andrex »

colordrops wrote: post #178
mStreamTeam wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've used polymer and I wasn't impressed. I found it was much slower than Vue and the docs left a lot to be desired.

What was slow about it? Depending on how you use template binding, it should be as fast as anything else.

It's possible he was using Polymer v1, which was pretty slow.

Polymer v2 in a web browser that supports Web Components v1 should be pretty fast, though. But that was only released last May.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#198

Post by Bahamut »

thomasDE wrote: post #196
pier25 wrote: post #132

We moved away from React to Vue about 8 months ago and everyone on the team is a lot happier. First reason is we hate JSX. It forces you to write loops, conditionals, etc, outside of the markup you are currently writing/reading. It's like writing shitty PHP code without templates. It also forces you to use a lot of boilerplate like bind(), Object.keys(), etc. Another problem with React is that it only really solves o…

> It's like writing shitty PHP code without templates. For me, it's the other way around. I feel like you can still separate the logic and markup, but instead of the template engine syntax you can just JavaScript. From the top of my head, I can at least remember six template engines' syntax I've learned: Smarty (PHP), Mustache, Blade (PHP), EJS, Angular and another custom template engine. When I tried React I was so…

To be fair, JSX has its own idiosyncracies too for templating, such as className, htmlFor, and the obnoxious attribute name for dynamically inserted html. It is not immune to the criticism that it requires learning.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#199

Post by pitaj »

eibrahim wrote: post #176
Kiro wrote: post #108

I've built semi-large applications in both Vue.js and React. I like both but prefer React. For me Vue.js is like a light-weight Angular 1, in a good way. It's very intuitive and you can start working immediately. It does however easily end up in confusion about where the state lives with the two-way binding. I've run into a lot of implicit state changes wrecking havoc. The declarative nature of React definitely wins…

I have been building web apps for 19+ years. I like many of the frameworks out there but for some reason I HATE React. I think JSX is a huge turnoff for me. I just can't get past html in javascript. It feels wrong. With that said, there are so many VERY smart people embracing React, so I am always questioning my "hate". Maybe one day I will change my mind. I haven't use Vue but watched/read about it and seems very co…

For a long time, people have been saying "separation of concerns" to support the idea of keeping HTML, JavaScript, and CSS in separate files.

The problem with that is that the document, application state, and styling is all highly coupled when dealing with web apps. Web pages which are content based are fine with these being separate, changes to one don't necessarily affect another.

For web pages, the separation of languages is a separation of concerns. However, for web apps, the separation of languages becomes a barrier, since everything about a certain behavior in your program could be in three different languages or more.

React changes this notion with the idea of a component. A component is ideally pure, meaning that it affects itself and it's children, and nothing else in the application. Components are composable, so you can combine multiple components, allowing for very DRY view code.

Idiomatically, React components have elements, styles, and the relevant code in a single file. This keeps things encapsulated and easily maintainable.

Re: Vue.js vs. React

#200

Post by octalmage »

colordrops wrote: post #178
mStreamTeam wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've used polymer and I wasn't impressed. I found it was much slower than Vue and the docs left a lot to be desired.

What was slow about it? Depending on how you use template binding, it should be as fast as anything else.

It was very slow to first paint around 1.0 which made me use something else. But it's become so much faster since then.
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