The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
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The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
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Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#2As far as I can tell, trolls thrive on a narrow Overton Window.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#3As far as I can tell, trolls thrive on a narrow Overton Window.
That's a pretty interesting though, never thought of it that way. Makes sense that the more things you can talk about, the less shock value they can extract from it.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#4I mean this week seems to have seen a very public and significant pushback against alt reich/gamergate/neonazi/MAGA idiots. It's been one of the worst weeks to be a white supremacist or racist in the US for quite some time.
So there are limits. Even Ted Cruz will eventually stand up and say: you know what, this is too fucking far. STOP.
They key to moving the Overton window is to do it gradually. Charlottesville was a massive overreach, and it backfired.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#5As far as I can tell, trolls thrive on a narrow Overton Window.
Is this a conjecture or a claim? In my experience the Overton Window is wider in the US than most other places, but there is also a greater tendency towards trolling in US society as well. These assertions would be challenging to measure, but might be amenable to proxy representations.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#6As far as I can tell, trolls thrive on a narrow Overton Window.
That's a pretty interesting though, never thought of it that way. Makes sense that the more things you can talk about, the less shock value they can extract from it.
From another perspective you could say they're lowering the bar overall, and you're saying the only way to deal with them is that you de-sensitize yourself to them. Nietzsche springs to mind, about gazing into abysses and battling monsters.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#7As far as I can tell, trolls thrive on a narrow Overton Window.
Is this a conjecture or a claim? In my experience the Overton Window is wider in the US than most other places, but there is also a greater tendency towards trolling in US society as well. These assertions would be challenging to measure, but might be amenable to proxy representations.
It's just my own observation. It's definitely wider in the US than other places but also enforced differently, depending on where you go. In the US, we have a "soft" enforcement, although with doxxing, etc., it's not so soft in many cases.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#8I have noticed posts on Facebook now, finally, asking people not to feed the trolls by responding to their messages.
I think that social media companies have been irresponsible in their passing the buck on moderating conversations in the name of avoiding censorship.
I am more concerned, however, that people my age and younger (gen x) never had civics in school. There used to be an assumption that the world is chaotic, and that all we have is each other, which meant that the best society has to offer is its culture. Being uncultured was seen as so uncouth that people wouldn't stand for it. Today it's everywhere.
I see people questioning other people's patriotism every day. I see conspiracy theories given the same benefit of the doubt as science. I see lies told on the news without retraction or accountability.
Without a mass movement to educate and inform people about how to think critically and treat one another with dignity, technology will be of little help.
That said, I'm still hopeful that the tech community can help leapfrog this ugliness. Or at least, quantify the problem and begin working towards solutions.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a pretty interesting though, never thought of it that way. Makes sense that the more things you can talk about, the less shock value they can extract from it.
From another perspective you could say they're lowering the bar overall, and you're saying the only way to deal with them is that you de-sensitize yourself to them. Nietzsche springs to mind, about gazing into abysses and battling monsters.
No, the result of a "narrow Overton window" is just anybody worth a damn leaving the conversation.
Which is what the trolls and their heroic free speech defenders really want. The primary objective of carrying around Nazi flags and or spewing hate against "feminists" is to silence everybody but yourself. This is exactly how the real Nazis did it.
Re: The Trance of Dysfunction: Why Trolls Have Come to Dominate Discourse
#10I mean this week seems to have seen a very public and significant pushback against alt reich/gamergate/neonazi/MAGA idiots. It's been one of the worst weeks to be a white supremacist or racist in the US for quite some time. So there are limits. Even Ted Cruz will eventually stand up and say: you know what, this is too fucking far. STOP. They key to moving the Overton window is to do it gradually. Charlottesville was…
You're seriously lumping gamergate into that?
The one thing I can't stand, and think is unfair, is when a few bad apples ruin a decentralized movement for everyone. BLM had the exact same problem, idiots delegitimizing a movement fighting a very legitimate problem, and then those scattered incidents being collected to allow organized detractors to mischaracterize them.
Now we're seeing that happen with the rightwing protests as well. Don't get me wrong, I hate nazis and also do not at all agree with Trump supporters / people that want to keep the confederate status, but they're not all nazis.