So cloudflare terminates the account of some pathetic racists, but happily continues to host Ripoff Report, a company whose basic business model is to defame people online and then extort them for money. You know, a site that actively ruins people lives, employment, etc. But a silly racist message board is what moves the CEO to take action.
Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
291–300 of 1001 posts
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#292Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are few things worse than nazis. Just make sure your content is better than fascist propaganda and you should be good.
How about ISIS? http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/anonymous-opisis-cloudflare-refuses...
Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot?
They killed _millions_ for arbitrary reasons. What about them?
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#293Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#294I get the whole "companies can choose not to host whatever they want" argument, but in order to do anything on the internet, you have to interact with companies. If I want to run my own website, I need an IP address at the minimum, and ISPs are free to cut off my internet service if they don't like what I'm hosting. In a public setting, if people don't like what I'm saying, they can't force me to be quiet (generally)…
> I get the whole "companies can choose not to host whatever they want" argument, but in order to do anything on the internet, you have to interact with companies.
If I switch what you said around a little bit:
"I get the whole 'people can choose to interact with whoever they want' argument, but in order to do anything, you have to interact with people."
So you're saying I have to interact with Nazis? I have no choice? Hardly.
People run these companies, and they're free to do business with whom they choose. Some ideologies are beyond the pale, and refusing to tolerate them is a perfectly reasonable choice.
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#295Earlier quoted context omitted.
For those who downvote me: so you're actually believing I call "anyone I don't like" a Nazi? How fucking pathetic is that? And no I don't care about the votes, I just want you to stop and realize how incredibly dumb that is. This is a kindergarten level of discourse on a subject that ranks amongst the most important that even exist. edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_St%C3%BCrmer That's where names like "Daily S…
To be fair to the GP, I've, for example, seen/heard my friends and acquaintances call people Nazis for condemning vigilante violence (e.g. "punching Nazis"), the Berkeley riots, and Antifa protests. I think the sentiment GP is trying to communicate is that many seem to throw the label out there without any further investigation as to whether its justified. As for the downvotes, it might be because your comment came a…
> I think the sentiment GP is trying to communicate is that many seem to throw the label out there without any further investigation as to whether its justified.
That's great, but totally irrelevant here, in response to me, in this context. When I call a dog a dog, I don't care that sometimes, somewhere, other people call a vase a dog. And it's incredibly rich in the context of "free speech" and whatnot: what use is my right to free speech, when people then also have the "right" to just replace what I say with some other anecdote in their mind? What use is being allowed to ask a question when people then just talk to each other about anything but the question? The protection of free speech arose in contexts where people suppressed speech because they otherwise would have to face it. If people don't face it anyway, there's no need to suppress any of it. And congratulations, too.
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#296Earlier quoted context omitted.
The site could, in theory, sue Cloudflare for failing to provide the services they paid for. That is, they could do so if they paid anything for the services they received (they didn't). And it's only if Cloudflare didn't have a "we reserve the right to discontinue services at any time for any reason at our sole discretion" clause in their ToS (they do).
Of course they can sue. Anybody can sue anybody else for whatever fancy they have. But that's not the same as winning that suit.
There's no need to be pedantic here. When a layperson talks about the ability of one person to sue another they mean the high likelihood of winning said suit.
We all know what the parent meant.
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#297Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is in a way much worse than if they actually changed their policy. With this precedent, it looks like what they're saying now is "we're not policing content, except for when our CEO feels like it". Basically this is a clear act of corruption, given their own proclaimed principles of content neutrality. That the ultimate trigger seems to have been that the removed site said something negative about CloudFlare is…
It's better than if they had reverse engineered the policy. Do it or don't do it, but either way, stand by your actions and get outta here with the mealy mouthed BS. IMHO.
I feel like a lot of Supreme Court decisions are reverse engineered. I'm not sure that bell can be un-rung.
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#298Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's so bizarre. He tries to have it both ways. He says "no one should have that power", but then says he did it literally earlier that day. He says CloudFlare isn't changing their "content-neutral" policy... but clearly they did change that policy. I have many reasons to oppose nazis, including incredibly personal ones. That said, I think crossing this content line for an infrastructure company is a big deal, and I…
I would want them to do this to ISIS and other terrorists.
And ISIS would want them to do it to the US government and a bunch of other sites.
Today you're in luck because the guys with this power are on your side.
What happens when they're not?
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#299So far we've partially lost our freedom of movement (take a look at the borders, the airports, etc).
We've heavily lost our freedoms around privacy.
Speech is the big prize for the authoritarians. Do not give it to them.
Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer
#300Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are few things worse than nazis. Just make sure your content is better than fascist propaganda and you should be good.
Most right wing politicians in the west have been called Nazis at one time or another.
As a member of neither continent, I find it beyond bizarre that in Europe, they're perfectly capable of determining from context whether someone called a 'nazi' is just having a slur thrown against them, or is actually a follower of the ideology, whereas in America they can't seem to tell the difference. Some yobbo calling a senator a nazi doesn't literally mean the senator is one, whereas people that wave nazi flags, openly promote nazi policies, and wander around giving the nazi salute are a different kettle of fish.
It's like that in America, what things are called is more important than what they are. Obviously there are plenty of Americans perfectly capable of understanding context, but they don't seem to be in control of the political narrative.