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NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

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Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#31

Post by dmor »

imgabe wrote: post #22
powrtoch wrote: post #2

Really though. If you wanted to claim that it was just for research, why give it such an inflammatory name? Compare: 1) WebReader is monitoring internet data. 2) Perfect Citizen is monitoring internet data. Which one do you expect to be a robocop-like being that will kick down your door at night and declare "verdict: guilty, sentence: execution"? Not that this doesn't reflect an irrational trust on your part of innoc…

I think to the mindset of someone who chooses to work for the NSA being like Robocop is a GOOD thing. After all, Robocop catches the bad guys. If he comes and kicks down your door, it's because you were doing something wrong. If you sign up to work for an agency like the NSA, you're probably doing it because you want to serve your country and protect it from the bad guys. You're not setting out to create some kind of…

you might not be setting out to create a police state, but neither were the majority of people signing up for the Nazi party. Don't confuse sincerity with being right

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#32

Post by noonespecial »

gaius wrote: post #28
imgabe wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think to the mindset of someone who chooses to work for the NSA being like Robocop is a GOOD thing. After all, Robocop catches the bad guys. If he comes and kicks down your door, it's because you were doing something wrong. If you sign up to work for an agency like the NSA, you're probably doing it because you want to serve your country and protect it from the bad guys. You're not setting out to create some kind of…

It amuses me, like in that James Bond film with Rosalind Pike, when Hollywood wants a secret organization even more sinister than the CIA they go for the NSA. I've (obv) never been to the NSA's office but I bet it's indistinguishable from any of the established high tech firms, like IBM or Boeing or Intel or Raytheon. Everyone clean-shaven and wearing a crisp white shirt. These guys write programs and research crypto…

From the government agencies I've done work in, I think it would be easily distinguishable from somewhere like Boeing. The government guys are the ones using Windows 98 and still trying to get the approval they started 9 years ago to upgrade to SE.

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#33

Post by mmaunder »

I love this photo! Classic geek with braided ponytail dressed in black sitting next to a uniformed guy (we hire both!). Both guys have 17 inch (or is it 15 inch) monitors that are switched off. Neither are looking at their screens. A quarter of the screen real-estate up front is taken up by NSA logos. The intelligence sign on the roof adds a certain irony. We can only hope the whole set is staged.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE66807I20100709

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#34

Post by metamemetics »

maukdaddy wrote: post #21
metamemetics wrote: post #12

If you are an American HNer, please tell your congressmen\women to reform the Electronic Communications Privacy Act if you have not already. Your private information should not be excluded from 4th ammendment protection just because it's on the Internet. If you don't know how to contact your representative\senator, the ACLU makes it extremely easy and can locate them for you and send a letter on your behalf via this…

If you're a US Citizen you don't have to worry about your information, since the NSA is forbidden by law from collecting information about US Citizens.

cough

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warrantless_surveillance_co...

cough

It's also important to update the ECPA because it would apply to ANY federal agency. There were a series of links to HN where cell phone companies built backend web apps for law enforcement officials to track people's phone location without warrents as long as they told the phone company it was for an emergency. In other words, it was being used by police to track the location of labor union protestors in one instance, the article confirmed.

The law needs to be updated due to a multitude of issues, such as Amazon.com being requested by the Department of Revenue to give them access to customer purchase history. Even on a basic level, is this something that programmers or web developers on HN want to be developing or maintaining?

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#37

Post by drawkbox »

daten wrote: post #24
drawkbox wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems there are more and more of these like the naming of the 'Patriot Act'. 'Perfect Citizen' is almost doublespeak at this point. What is happening here?

I think the people involved with naming these programs live in a very different environment and have a very different mindset than the people who think these are obviously bad names. Can you list more than one previous example that fits this pattern?

I guess naming is part of selling it. If it was named as it actually is they would never pass.

Stuff as simple as the 'War on Terorism' when they are on our side in the 80's in Afghanistan for instance they were 'Freedom Fighters'

As far as bills:

- USA Patriot Act = Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001

- Operation Liberty Shield - http://www.dhs.gov/xnews/releases/press_release_0115.shtm

- Homeland Security Act - http://www.dhs.gov/xabout/laws/law_regulation_rule_0011.shtm

- S.A.F.E.T.Y Act - http://www.dhs.gov/xabout/laws/editorial_0878.shtm

- ...

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#38

Post by patrickgzill »

maukdaddy wrote: post #21
metamemetics wrote: post #12

If you are an American HNer, please tell your congressmen\women to reform the Electronic Communications Privacy Act if you have not already. Your private information should not be excluded from 4th ammendment protection just because it's on the Internet. If you don't know how to contact your representative\senator, the ACLU makes it extremely easy and can locate them for you and send a letter on your behalf via this…

If you're a US Citizen you don't have to worry about your information, since the NSA is forbidden by law from collecting information about US Citizens.

I do not believe that anymore.

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#39

Post by smallblacksun »

maukdaddy wrote: post #21
metamemetics wrote: post #12

If you are an American HNer, please tell your congressmen\women to reform the Electronic Communications Privacy Act if you have not already. Your private information should not be excluded from 4th ammendment protection just because it's on the Internet. If you don't know how to contact your representative\senator, the ACLU makes it extremely easy and can locate them for you and send a letter on your behalf via this…

If you're a US Citizen you don't have to worry about your information, since the NSA is forbidden by law from collecting information about US Citizens.

If you are a US Citizen within the US talking to another US citizen within the US, this is true.

Re: NSA Hooking Up Ominously Named 'Perfect Citizen' To Watch The Internet

#40

Post by smallblacksun »

mmaunder wrote: post #33

I love this photo! Classic geek with braided ponytail dressed in black sitting next to a uniformed guy (we hire both!). Both guys have 17 inch (or is it 15 inch) monitors that are switched off. Neither are looking at their screens. A quarter of the screen real-estate up front is taken up by NSA logos. The intelligence sign on the roof adds a certain irony. We can only hope the whole set is staged. http://www.reuters.…

When they film inside an intelligence agency, they either turn off monitors displaying sensitive information or show non-sensitive information on them (like the NSA logo).
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