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Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

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Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#31

Post by ttoinou »

akerro wrote: post #27

>The thing is, theses users don't come to my product page for getting updates for example, so I think it's a loss for me because I can't reach them and talk to them. You assume that they would buy in in the first place. I would not spend a penny on 95% stuff I pirated. Most of the stuff was a one time thing, like game was too boring (I would request a refund), game had too high requrements, so I couldn't even start a…

  You assume that they would buy in in the first place
No I didn't say that and I don't believe it. What I believe is that I would prefer thoses pirates to come to the official website to know about the product features and update, being able to comment it and ask for advices and get the feeling that someone is working behind it etc.. Everything is lost when people go to private forums and ask the new update to the software cracking team

I'm not selling a game but a very useful productivity tool. But yeah I'll try to build 'hype' anyway thanks :)

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#32

Post by ttoinou »

warrenm wrote: post #9

First - if they wouldn't have paid anyway, you haven't "lost" anything (you've actually gained something) Second, your pricing must be turning off those who would [possibly] pay, but opt for the cracked edition due to cost Third, focus on support: you can download, install, and run OpenNMS, for example, totally 100% for free. But if you want support beyond the mailing list, you pay for it.

  Third, focus on support: you can download, install, and run OpenNMS, for example, totally 100% for free. But if you want support beyond the mailing list, you pay for it.
I feel like it's what's going on actually. You can get my plugins for free on forums by doing a stupid google search, or you can buy it officially and get support.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#33

Post by yodon »

yodon wrote: post #14
1388 wrote: post #4

Old methods (90s): - turn to the law (DCMA) - prevent people from modifying code New methods: - change to a SaaS model - change the backend to an API, users order API key - ping home from your software code or every keystroke like in Windows. - free product, offer training + ads

This is why there were no new software startups of any significance launched between 1995 (when web browsers made piracy trivial) and 2006 (when Salesforce.com launched the first modern SaaS business).

To the downvoter(s): I'm genuinely curious, can you name any significant software companies that launched during that era? I've not done an exhaustive search, but I've looked for them and have had a much harder time finding software companies with launch dates of 1996-2005 than 2006 (the successful launch count in that window obviously wasn't zero but I'm pretty sure it's down significantly from the before and after eras).

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#34

Post by iamben »

A while back a friend of mine told me he installed a 'clean my Mac' application, thought it was decent and went looking for a crack. So the story went - the top link was one to their own website with full instructions on how to crack the app - something like - www.appname.com/how-to-crack-appname/, or whatever.

On the page was complete and detailed instructions on how to crack it yourself using a hex editor or decompiler (or whatever!). Except, he said as you read down, the way the author explained it really highlighted how much effort he put into making it, and at the bottom copy saying something like "we hope this was useful and avoids you using a crack which might damage your machine, we also hope you realise the effort that goes into making software and will consider paying just $xx dollars which goes towards feeding my family and making more software".

Friend was so impressed he just got out his card and bought it.

TL;DR - They embraced the piracy / understood those that won't pay never will, those that may can be persuaded, so made something educational and thoughtful out of it.

Hope you figure it out!

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#35

Post by aerovistae »

JamesBaxter wrote: post #21

Many people I know have always pirated software and TV and said once there was a reasonable way to get it legally they would pay for it. I haven't seen this be the case. I don't think you can convert pirates. It is possible however to convert legal users to pirates by having systems that annoy people who have legally purchased. I don't know how you strike the balance. I hate the entitlement of people who pirate stuff…

Speaking as a prolific pirate, I currently pay for Spotify because it's just so convenient. I currently pay for HBO Now because I don't want to wait an extra hour to watch Game of Thrones.

I pay for games on Steam, but I still pirate most major creative software like Adobe, Windows Office, or DAWs and their plugins...I just have absolutely zero incentive to do otherwise.

And before anyone guilt trips me on morality, please stop to carefully think through why you believe sharing digital files is stealing but borrowing a book from a library or buying a used video game or movie is not. None of those things give ANY proceeds to the authors or creators, either, and the authors have no choice in that matter either. Yet society deems that arbitrarily acceptable.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#36

Post by qualitytime »

iamben wrote: post #34

A while back a friend of mine told me he installed a 'clean my Mac' application, thought it was decent and went looking for a crack. So the story went - the top link was one to their own website with full instructions on how to crack the app - something like - www.appname.com/how-to-crack-appname/, or whatever. On the page was complete and detailed instructions on how to crack it yourself using a hex editor or decomp…

Thats a great story and thumbs up to the app makers you mention.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#37

Post by balls187 »

> My paying customers are professional in the industry I work on. Most of my pirates might very well be "amateurs" in the sense that they don't make money with theirs activity and I'm fine with it.

> theses users don't come to my product page for getting updates for example, so I think it's a loss for me because I can't reach them and talk to them. I feel like I won't ever be able to convert them to paying customers.

It sounds like you'd like to have these customers as actual customers and if it's your thesis that those who pirate the software aren't professional consider licensing.

1. Have a low-cost, or "pay what you want" license model, for non-comercial use.

2. Have a free-for-students license. Only for education use.

3. Offer upgrade pricing spiffs to convert from the free/low tier to the pro-tier.

4. Consider a subscription approach. I would never pay the full price for Photoshop/Lightroom, but the Adobe Creative Cloud for Photographers is $9.99 a month, which is the right price for my needs.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#38

Post by michaelbuckbee »

JamesBaxter wrote: post #21

Many people I know have always pirated software and TV and said once there was a reasonable way to get it legally they would pay for it. I haven't seen this be the case. I don't think you can convert pirates. It is possible however to convert legal users to pirates by having systems that annoy people who have legally purchased. I don't know how you strike the balance. I hate the entitlement of people who pirate stuff…

A good case study to look at is probably Game of Thrones - widely reported to be the most pirated TV show. At last report HBO Now (digital on demand only) was at 2mil subscribers.

I'm one of them and converted to paying when I didn't need a full cable package just to watch it.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#39

Post by ttoinou »

iamben wrote: post #34

A while back a friend of mine told me he installed a 'clean my Mac' application, thought it was decent and went looking for a crack. So the story went - the top link was one to their own website with full instructions on how to crack the app - something like - www.appname.com/how-to-crack-appname/, or whatever. On the page was complete and detailed instructions on how to crack it yourself using a hex editor or decomp…

Yes I might do that in the future, I have to be the first google result of "MyProduct Crack" ;)

But if the official author of the plugin gives it for free it sends a weird message to paying customers, no ?

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with piracy?

#40

Post by josteink »

JamesBaxter wrote: post #21

Many people I know have always pirated software and TV and said once there was a reasonable way to get it legally they would pay for it. I haven't seen this be the case. I don't think you can convert pirates. It is possible however to convert legal users to pirates by having systems that annoy people who have legally purchased. I don't know how you strike the balance. I hate the entitlement of people who pirate stuff…

> Many people I know have always pirated software and TV and said once there was a reasonable way to get it legally they would pay for it. I haven't seen this be the case. I don't think you can convert pirates.

I grew up on a 100% pirated diet. I now develop software for a living.

I'd be an absolute hypocrite to pirate commercial software when I myself demand to be paid for my commercial efforts.

You won't see me running any pirated software at all.

Of course, given the choice and options we have today, in practice it means I'm running much less commercial software, and depend almost entirely on open source software.

For that software I try to "pay" by contributing back when I can and it feels natural.

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