Google has become anti-science and has joined fake-news/facts movement in it's messaging about this issue. This is a new low, I would not have expected. Opinion.
Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
121–130 of 507 posts
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#122There are 2 sentences in the entire article about Sundar, essentially saying he should have handled this better. There is no great way to handle this. If he hadn't fired him there would be 10x more articles demanding his resignation as many outraged employees would leave and diversity efforts set back.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#123It seems disingenuous not to mention the many debunkings of the memo's Science by Scientists. For example: https://www.quora.com/What-do-scientists-think-about-the-bio...
I've also read several supporting takes by scientists in related fields as well. The statements Damore made are indeed supported by some studies, and science being science, there are studies which conflict it as well. Pretending 'science' supports one political view or another is the sort of thing that got us in this mess in the first place. I think if we're going to avoid being disingenuous, we need to recognize tha…
I tend to take "supported by" to mean "there is support for it" not "everything supports it". I would use "confirmed" to describe the latter. (and yes, nothing is ever absolutely confirmed, bit were talking about everyday language here)
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#124"He could have wrestled with the tension between population-level research and individual experience. He could have stood up for the free flow of information."
Honestly I don't agree. It's his job to facilitate an enjoyable work environment not be a champion of free speech. Free speech is plentiful outside the workplace. If you want to contact HR go for it.
But the person who wrote the memo opened a can of worms implying that his perspective was super valuable to the discussion rather than the many female employees who work there. There are a myriad of debatable perpestives but this was not the appropriate channel to vent them.
Women want to be respected by their coworkers and arguments like "biologically we've hit the max amount of women who are interested in this field" don't align with our experience.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
Incidentally, what Damore did is probably a 'concerted protected activity' (his stated goal is to take actions that improve working conditions by making the job less stressful, increase diversity, etc) covered by the NLRB, and thus Google quite possibly broke the law in firing him for the memo. That's not protecting the company. EDIT: I forgot to add that from the coverage I've seen, there are also claims that Google…
If you are trying to improve working conditions, and in doing so creating a hostile working environment, your employer is obligated to fire you. If they don't, they can be sued by other employees. And let me tell you, while you may not feel that this memo has created a hostile working environment, a lot of other people do. Google would drown in lawsuits if they let him stay on.
But would such lawsuits succeed?
I don't see how you can argue that a single guy who isn't in management writing a memo creates a "hostile work environment". Most of the people complaining wouldn't even be working with him at all. They can file lawsuits but would they hold water? After all, management could just tell the lawsuit filers to be more tolerant of others: it's not like Damore was attacking individuals.
So I don't see where Google's obligation to fire him comes from. Unpopularity with other employees does not make a legal obligation.
On the other hand, firing someone who is trying to raise possibly illegal conduct with management does have legal implications.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#126I must have read a different memo than everyone else. The one I read said that the massive gender imbalance in software could be due to genetics, and because of that we shouldn't try to fix it with policy. But the reality is that there is a gender imbalance in software because of the way women are treated, and the best way to correct that is through policies that treat them better. It shouldn't be a stretch to see th…
You must have read a different memo. The one he wrote can be described by the second part of your comment.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#127Honestly, I think he made the right move just from a PR perspective. His firing makes sense: the CEO and HR are both acting to protect the company. The author of the manifesto caused Google a PR disaster and created a huge state of internal conflict, valid or not. The shareholders are probably really happy that their CEO removed a person who managed to get Google so much bad press in so little time. This is the reali…
> The shareholders are probably really happy that their CEO removed a person who managed to get Google so much bad press in so little time. Debatable, the shareholders might not be happy that Google might now become a political target for oppressing views. However, I agree that given potential liability issues from hostile workplace lawsuits almost forced his hand, which is very unfortunate.
The leakers of the memo caused the bad press. It was an internal affair until that happened.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
So why not encourage men to pursue careers in nursing and teaching?
I would go ahead and say because men are just not interested in those careers as much as women. That's the whole point. And that is fine.
The point is disputed: to what extent are the differences biological vs. environmental? Hiring practices could influence preferences.
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#129Convincing women to focus on a career in STEM is telling them that their choices for careers in nursing, teaching, and any other career dominated by women are wrong choices. I don't believe that, they are essential to our society and are arguably more important than helping create better ads at Google and Facebook.
So why not encourage men to pursue careers in nursing and teaching?
There's a lot of effort going into this, actually. My father was a nurse for 30 years and in his nursing school graduation photo, and his retirement photo with his colleagues, he was still the only male. It's possible men view these fields as female dominated and resist applying. It also raises the awkward question of how men are treated in female dominated fields. Would a man be treated better in a female dominated field, than a female in a male dominated field, or the same? I've not seen research on this, unless someone knows of any?
Re: Sundar Pichai Should Resign as Google’s C.E.O
#130I must have read a different memo than everyone else. The one I read said that the massive gender imbalance in software could be due to genetics, and because of that we shouldn't try to fix it with policy. But the reality is that there is a gender imbalance in software because of the way women are treated, and the best way to correct that is through policies that treat them better. It shouldn't be a stretch to see th…
Who is arguing against treating people respectfully? For the sake of argument, if a group is less inclined towards a given profession, isn't it disrespectful to push them into it?