It seems like these kinds of salaries only really exist for full time employees in the US. As a software architect (engineer team size ~100) in the UK I was only making £65k. I could have shopped around and got more, much more if I went to London but still nothing like I read about in the US. I ended up leaving full time employment for contracting/consulting.
I can only assume you earn much more as a contractor.
Yet I always try to see through different angles. Are there any drawbacks of being a contractor, in comparison to full time employee?
"The mansplaining in this thread is off the scale" OK, I assume you're of what used to known as the female gender and as such disqualified to comment on any male related issues. I shall be keeping an eye on you from now on. By any chance would the opposite of 'mansplaining' be bitchsplaining, I wonder :) mansplaining:: a term of abuse used in the lunatic fringe of third-wave feminism to shut down discourse.
We've banned this account for personal attack, ideological boilerplate, and breaking the guideline against calling names in arguments.
The parent comment wasn't substantive but that doesn't mean you can break the site rules like this.
I mean, it's pretty simple, but it took a long time to internalize: If you don't have anyone else making you an offer, then you're worth that amount. In this case, you were worth $42k and $56k respectively. If you'd shopped around, you'd have been worth more. But you didn't, so you weren't. That's not a bad thing, either. Security is nice, and interviews are a pain. But it really is that simple. If you don't like you…
> the reason why, yet you're paid table scraps -- it's because that's what you're worth. That doesn't make any sense and sounds like everyone is always paid fairly. That's far from true.
If you think you're not being paid fairly, do something about it (e.g. demand more, or quit and do something else for money).
If you can't get more, you're not being exploited. You're taking advantage of the best option available to you.
> "that's what you're worth" Your argument is sound, but this is really unfortunate phrasing. It's actually what your work is worth. Not what you as a person is worth, and it's important to keep those things separate, both for sanity and rigor.
Your value to society is the value of your work which in everyone else's context is your value. No one cares if your apartment is clean which is why no one pays you to clean your apartment.
Except the entire point is that the demand sets the amount of money you earn and not your capability. You could be einstein in the sahara and yet still be stuck doing subsistence farming. The GP projects this demand based income as personal worth even though multiple income levels are possible which would imply multiple "worths". What you do doesn't define your worth. A system for rewarding and punishing somebody for good or bad work already exists. There is no need for some bullshit "value" or "worth" concept that is attached to the person.
By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
Your point about companies absorbing and mitigating risk, and doing lots of risk assessment, is one of the biggest issues missing from her consideration. It's very simplistic to look at salaries from the standpoint of product delivery alone.
One could argue that the larger the corporation, the more risk is diffused across the organisation. It's not simply about keeping the lights on at headquarters.
It's also another reason why salaries are generally higher in the USA for the same programming job: pay is higher because risk is greater (stock market, investment, litigation, etc).
By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
Out of interest which European tech hub did you move to? Berlin? I am currently looking at making a move and would love to hear some first hand experience of the tech hubs in Europe that people have moved to.
"The mansplaining in this thread is off the scale" OK, I assume you're of what used to known as the female gender and as such disqualified to comment on any male related issues. I shall be keeping an eye on you from now on. By any chance would the opposite of 'mansplaining' be bitchsplaining, I wonder :) mansplaining:: a term of abuse used in the lunatic fringe of third-wave feminism to shut down discourse.
We've banned this account for personal attack, ideological boilerplate, and breaking the guideline against calling names in arguments. The parent comment wasn't substantive but that doesn't mean you can break the site rules like this.
Who did you ban? The first response or second one?
By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
i think programmers and a lot of other people get paid way too much. i used to wash dishes and the other guy who washed dishes, who worked right next to me, was an immigrant. he worked 12 hours a day every single solitary day. without him, the restaurant would grind to a halt. so, like stephanie, he was a huge part of all the money that was made. and yet, he gets paid less than minimum wage. he works harder than anyone else i have ever known and yet he gets paid a pittance. he make their business possible and yet he is paid a pittance. let me tell you that seeing programmers make 50k a year for basically no work compared to my friend, its amazing to me. and when i see white collar workers complain that they only make 100k, it makes me angry. the vast, vast majority of white collar workers are not worth anything close to what they are paid. i know a guy who works four hours a week and is paid more than 80k. four hours of typing per week. the level of privilege is astounding among programmers. so please dont complain.