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Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

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Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#201

Post by andrepd »

redthrowaway wrote: post #153
hueving wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. This is because most of society is still struggling with day-to-day tasks like getting housing, clean water, reliable food, healthcare and dealing with physical conflicts. Even people rich enough to not be stuck in the s…

>This is because most of society is still struggling with day-to-day tasks like getting housing, clean water, reliable food, healthcare and dealing with physical conflicts. It's been nearly 100 years since anyone struggled with that in the West. Nobody's expecting Eritrea to put a satellite in orbit.

>It's been nearly 100 years since anyone struggled with that in the West.

The privilege is palpable. That's almost insulting.

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#202

Post by flukus »

BurningFrog wrote: post #144
semaphoreP wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually this star is not in the Kepler Field, and it is also too bright for Kepler. Even most ground based telescopes looking for transits probably haven't bothered looking at it, due to its brightness.

Thanks, I had no idea Kepler was under these constraints. I'd expect it's easier to measure at the brighter stars. Maybe calibrating the instrument for the weaker stars makes it "overload" for a really bright ones?

You're in for a treat, "Kepler 2.0" launches next year: https://tess.gsfc.nasa.gov/overview.html

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#203

Post by lifthrasiir »

bpodgursky wrote: post #188
hueving wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. This is because most of society is still struggling with day-to-day tasks like getting housing, clean water, reliable food, healthcare and dealing with physical conflicts. Even people rich enough to not be stuck in the s…

The world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts in the 60s, and we still had the Apollo program put people on the moon. Only the most pathetic hacks would argue that we are the worse for having invested that money to push the bounds of exploration. At a point, there are 6 billion people on the earth, and there will always be _some_ problems unso…

> The world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts in the 60s, and we still had the Apollo program put people on the moon.

You could (more or less) translate the fascination of the moon landing into an excuse for less reliable housing and so on in the 60s. You can't do so today.

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#204

Post by andrepd »

ExactoKnight wrote: post #183
gnaritas wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's been nearly 100 years since anyone struggled with that in the West. You have go to be joking.

You can nitpick the exceptions, but his general point about affluent living standards existing for 100 years in the West for most people is true.

What is most? Is it more than 50%? Then maybe, but certainly not for 100 years. Or is it the vast majority? Because GP did say "anyone" in his post. Then I'd like to quote:

Almost every fourth person in the EU still experiences at least one of the three forms of poverty or social exclusion. Monetary poverty is the most widespread form of poverty, affecting 17.3 % of EU residents in 2015. Severe material deprivation and very low work intensity follow, affecting 8.1 % of the EU residents and 10.6 % of EU citizens aged 0 to 59, respectively.

http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/...

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#205

Post by ams6110 »

bpodgursky wrote: post #188
hueving wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. This is because most of society is still struggling with day-to-day tasks like getting housing, clean water, reliable food, healthcare and dealing with physical conflicts. Even people rich enough to not be stuck in the s…

The world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts in the 60s, and we still had the Apollo program put people on the moon. Only the most pathetic hacks would argue that we are the worse for having invested that money to push the bounds of exploration. At a point, there are 6 billion people on the earth, and there will always be _some_ problems unso…

The Apollo program did result in significant advances in science and technology.

Had we put the same resources into solving other more earthbound problems would we be better off? Maybe we could have developed a better, standard, safer nuclear power plant design and could have left coal and oil behind 30 years ago. And we would not be discussing climate change or at least not the idea that it was man-made.

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#206

Post by slimsag »

bpodgursky wrote: post #188
hueving wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. This is because most of society is still struggling with day-to-day tasks like getting housing, clean water, reliable food, healthcare and dealing with physical conflicts. Even people rich enough to not be stuck in the s…

The world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts in the 60s, and we still had the Apollo program put people on the moon. Only the most pathetic hacks would argue that we are the worse for having invested that money to push the bounds of exploration. At a point, there are 6 billion people on the earth, and there will always be _some_ problems unso…

> The world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts in the 60s, and we still had the Apollo program put people on the moon.

Of course, you do realize that statement could also read: "When we ran the Apollo program, the world had less reliable housing, less clean water, less reliable food, worse healthcare, and more physical conflicts."

Neither of these statements are particularly good at answering the question: How much do we gain by investing money in space exploration versus something else?

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#207

Post by andrepd »

WednesdayThrow1 wrote: post #172
BigChiefSmokem wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless they can explain to their shareholders what the benefit of that overwhelmingly long-term investment will be I don't see it happening. Maybe after SpaceX becomes a massively profitable company in the same vein as the tech giants, but not before. Bill Gates also made it painfully clear that he wants his money to go to issues we can resolve right now here on Earth like renewable energy, clean water, fighting dise…

I've yet to see a non emotional explanation for why diversity hiring is good over meritocracy, yet that is thrust upon shareholders.

If nothing else, it's good PR.

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#208

Post by ExactoKnight »

andrepd wrote: post #200
ExactoKnight wrote: post #101

I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. A telescope this large could tell us whether any of these potentially habitable planets contain oxygen, and thus, biological processes. Yet thanks to funding cuts in science the biggest telescope we have in the pipeline r…

Putting it bluntly: I'm not flabbergasted because I don't live in a bubble. The great majority of people in this planet have more pressing things to worry about than a 100 metre telescope, things like housing, having food for tomorrow, money, not getting killed, not getting raped, not getting exploited by rich oligarchs/the government, etc etc. Man, I too wish we had more money for large scale scientific endeavours,…

The money is there. U.S. military spending far exceeds spending on science.

By another commentators estimate, the 100 Metre Telescope would cost ~$15 billion to build. In comparison the F-35 fighter jet program cost $168 billion, and in 10 years the U.S. will spend roughly $5.5 trillion on its military.

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#209

Post by notreallythough »

ExactoKnight wrote: post #101

I am flabbergasted that as a society we aren't rushing to build a 100 metre wide telescope mirror large enough for us to directly image the spectra of the potentially habitable exoplanets around us. A telescope this large could tell us whether any of these potentially habitable planets contain oxygen, and thus, biological processes. Yet thanks to funding cuts in science the biggest telescope we have in the pipeline r…

100? why not 1000!?

Re: Four Earth-sized planets detected orbiting the nearest sun-like star

#210

Post by andrepd »

ExactoKnight wrote: post #208
andrepd wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putting it bluntly: I'm not flabbergasted because I don't live in a bubble. The great majority of people in this planet have more pressing things to worry about than a 100 metre telescope, things like housing, having food for tomorrow, money, not getting killed, not getting raped, not getting exploited by rich oligarchs/the government, etc etc. Man, I too wish we had more money for large scale scientific endeavours,…

The money is there. U.S. military spending far exceeds spending on science. By another commentators estimate, the 100 Metre Telescope would cost ~$15 billion to build. In comparison the F-35 fighter jet program cost $168 billion, and in 10 years the U.S. will spend roughly $5.5 trillion on its military.

The point is that if you can convince people to demand a budget cuts for the military, they will almost surely demand to allocate the funds to more pressing needs than space exploration. Most people would sooner want that money spend on things that could improve their lives in a tangible and immediate way than spend it on something that does not benefit them directly in any way.
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