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Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

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Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#101

Post by majormajor »

hota_mazi wrote: post #80
seorphates wrote: post #47

Working in open office plans is simply awful. Personally I believe remote work, for any tech-enabled employer, makes the most sense. The impact on infrastructure by removing commuting alone could maybe help save the planet. And our collective sanity. Wouldn't it be nice to have ISPs that can provide an infrastructure that could actually support that? I think so. The hideous effects of cluster-fucking hundreds of thou…

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be an acceptable compromise but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. You gain a lot with open space plans: more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. And of course, the company can cram more people in the same place.

Sadly, I'm still looking for headphones that can be comfortably worn over my ears + glasses for more than an hour at a time. In-ear ones have other comfort issues.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#102

Post by kuschku »

hota_mazi wrote: post #80
seorphates wrote: post #47

Working in open office plans is simply awful. Personally I believe remote work, for any tech-enabled employer, makes the most sense. The impact on infrastructure by removing commuting alone could maybe help save the planet. And our collective sanity. Wouldn't it be nice to have ISPs that can provide an infrastructure that could actually support that? I think so. The hideous effects of cluster-fucking hundreds of thou…

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be an acceptable compromise but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. You gain a lot with open space plans: more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. And of course, the company can cram more people in the same place.

That's some fine sarcasm you've got there. That said, there are apparently people defending this opinion.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#103

Post by aphextron »

IanDrake wrote: post #88
IBM wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The WSJ story has some pictures of what it looks like [1]. There seems to be offices with doors, but they look like it seats about 20 people. There are also common areas with long tables between them. https://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-UF776_0817CO_1... https://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-UF775_0817CO_1... https://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-UF777_0817CO_1... [1] https://www.wsj.com/art…

Oh boy, two desks facing each other with low walls. Here's what that's like: You're looking at your monitor and in your peripheral vision, just above your monitor, is someone looking at their monitor. You're basically looking at each other. They answer their mobile with their head phones on. "Hey" It looks like they're looking at you and you never saw their subtle click on the inline toggle below your view. "What's u…

Let's not forget the constant awkward fleeting moments of eye contact with someone you barely know and don't wish to talk to.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#104

Post by tomsthumb »

Aqua_Geek wrote: post #36
gervase wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect the thought process is something like, "Collaboration makes the office more productive. Therefore, if we force the employees to collaborate all the time , we can maximize productivity!"

The most productive days I've ever had at my current employer -- by a significant margin --- were when most of the company was not present (off-site or holiday). Being able to come in those days and work in a distraction-free environment was amazing. Open office floor plans are the worst.

RIP July 5th when no one came into the office. I'll miss you till next year.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#105

Post by J_Sherz »

dasmoth wrote: post #69
nashashmi wrote: post #15

Man, I remember in college when we would be working long hours in the library on a computer lined up in a row of computers. Every one would be intensely working on what they needed to. Sometimes two would work together. This was especially true before presentations when we were trying to put our stuff together. It was neat. It was collaborative. It was fun. And we were happy. Open floor plan is reminiscent of those d…

The comments about library etiquette are on to something. But I think it also helps that most of the other people in the library are probably strangers, and if a couple of them are talking it's probably about something quite different from what you're working on. "Team" conversations that might possibly be relevant to your stuff are the worst distractions.

Agreed - I liken it to my college experience: if you want to eat or drink anything other than water, or talk to other people, you go to the coffee shop.

If you want to focus on your work and take breaks to do the rest you go to the library.

I always chose the coffee shop, so open offices don't bother me hugely. The caveat is that a good pair of headphones is a must.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#107

Post by mathattack »

I'm ok with an open office, but my job is to be interupted. It's less good for deep thinking jobs, or heavy phone call jobs. Our engineers don't seem to mind though, maybe they just plug in their headsets?

Joel Spolsky wrote about this [1] though his main citation is experience at Microsoft.

I do have to admit Open Floors are a shift for a company focused on secrecy.

[1] https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2008/12/29/the-new-fog-creek-...

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#108

Post by georgemcbay »

kuschku wrote: post #102
hota_mazi wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be an acceptable compromise but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. You gain a lot with open space plans: more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. And of course, the company can cram more people in the same place.

That's some fine sarcasm you've got there. That said, there are apparently people defending this opinion.

Are you sure your parent post is sarcasm? The sad reality of the modern tech industry is that I actually think that is a serious response, though I wouldn't be surprised either way.

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#109

Post by stevesearer »

peeters wrote: post #92

> bench seating Wait long tables is one thing, but what on earth does bench seating mean? Like it's one long picnic table?

"Benching" refers to a style of desk system that connects into a row.

Example from Steelcase: https://www.steelcase.com/products/benching/frameone/

Re: Apple staffers reportedly rebelling against open office plan

#110

Post by pilsetnieks »

hota_mazi wrote: post #80
seorphates wrote: post #47

Working in open office plans is simply awful. Personally I believe remote work, for any tech-enabled employer, makes the most sense. The impact on infrastructure by removing commuting alone could maybe help save the planet. And our collective sanity. Wouldn't it be nice to have ISPs that can provide an infrastructure that could actually support that? I think so. The hideous effects of cluster-fucking hundreds of thou…

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be an acceptable compromise but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. You gain a lot with open space plans: more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. And of course, the company can cram more people in the same place.

You should be more wary of Poe's law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law) in the future.
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