Why Germans pay cash for almost everything • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#201

Post by herbst » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:55 PM UTC

tylershuster wrote: post #103

codegeek wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an american, I find it strange that cash is faster. Most people who pay cash need to wait to get the change back unless they know the total beforehand and happen to have exact change. In the US, credit card machines are very fast even the chip enabled ones. Cash workflow: - Cashier tells you the total amount - You look in your wallet/purse - You spend time counting exact change if you do have it - If not, you take…

*Credit card workflow: - Cashier tells you the total amount - You look in your wallet/purse - You swipe card/insert in chip reader - You avoid making eye contact while the transaction is processed - (optional) The card reader fails and requests reinsertion. Repeat previous two steps - Done

You missed the part when they are in holidays in Europa or Asia and realize that American whatever credit card is usually not accepted and they begin shouting at everyone what kind of third world country this is.

Disclaimer: I've seen exactly this a few times

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#202

Post by paulsutter » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:55 PM UTC

Use of credit cards in the US really took off in 1980 when interest rates were deregulated[1], credit cards were then heavily promoted. I remember at that time, to use a credit card in a grocery store had a social stigma. But now, many people here rarely use cash.

What are the credit card interest rates in Germany? (In the US credit card interest rates can be 20-30%). Maybe there's less incentive to promote use of cards in Germany, or maybe transaction fees are regulated to make small transactions impractical?

[1] https://www.fdic.gov/bank/analytical/bank/bt_9805.html

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#203

Post by thesumofall » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:55 PM UTC

The article is missing one key piece: how are card payments developing over time? My personal experience is that things have changed rapidly over the last years with most larger stores now accepting credit cards and contactless payments are increasingly becoming normal (just months ago cashiers might have looked dumbfounded at you when waving your card over the reader).

It is also critical to note that Germany has some of the lowest prices for groceries. Shops have hence been very slow in offering credit card payments.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#204

Post by celticninja » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:56 PM UTC

Sleeep wrote: post #190

fleg wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contactless payments don't need PIN (up to some small but comfortable amount) and go through almost instantly.

I tried to use android pay for a few months. In theory its great (and it's great when it works!) but like 30% of the time it doesn't really work the first time, you have to play around with it on the card reader. Then the phone vibrates like it worked but nothing happens. You look at the phone and it says "please hold the card to the reader again." and despite Subway accepting android pay (and the cashiers insisting…

Contactless debit cards are a lot more reliable than phones, mainly because they have one unique job. My card plays up now and again but that is only since it went through the tumble dryer, which distorted the card and seems to have affected the reliability of the NFC chip, in practice this means I sometimes need to tap twice.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#205

Post by lanevorockz » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:56 PM UTC

felipelemos wrote: post #186

mtmail wrote: post #2

According to https://www.cashforless.de/ec_cash_info/Fakten_zur_Kartenzah... methods for payments in stores 2011 was 57% cash, 5.3% credit card, 33% debit card ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_cash ). > "of course, [the Germans] attitudes toward currency must owe something to Germany’s tumultuous monetary history. During the Weimar-era hyperinflation that peaked in 1923 [...]" > "the German tendency to sett…

Brazilian here. We had a three-to-four-digit annual inflation rates that last 14 years, from 1980 to 1994 (and it topped 5000% on the last year). Almost everyone uses debit or credit card nowadays. Even transport cards machines, taxis, small vendors, food trucks accepts credit cards. Usually I only carry cash for some emergency to the point I don't even remember how much I left on my wallet.

To be fair, in Brazil we usually prefer cards because of the risk of being robbed.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#206

Post by cleansy » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:56 PM UTC

German living in UK here. I think the flaky-currency argument is non-sense. I see this argument mostly in anglo-american articles when the authors try to figure out why germans are still mostly cash-transactional.

I paid in cash back home mostly because it's faster. Cashiers are used to calculate the change and quick getting it out. CC/Debit card payments take a bit longer, since you almost only have chipped payments, get the device to work, enter pin, wait for receipt that you have to sign sometimes, etc. I was never pick pocketed on the street, so this wasn't an issue either.

I only started paying by card with the introduction of NFC/ "contactless" payments, since this one is faster.

Also, the UK coins are quite heavy having €10 worth of coins is half the volume at least compared to the old pounds.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#207

Post by Sleeep » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:57 PM UTC

sparkling wrote: post #87

_Codemonkeyism wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a German a.) I mostly pay cash because it's faster b.) some shops that can afford it only have cash payments to save on CC costs Not because of inflation or because something happend 100y ago.

As a German a) I don't want to feed the Visa/Mastercard/Amex/Whatever leach earning a few cents of every transaction.

Handling cash is not free either, it also comes with transaction costs.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#208

Post by dingo_bat » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:58 PM UTC

paulsutter wrote: post #202

Use of credit cards in the US really took off in 1980 when interest rates were deregulated[1], credit cards were then heavily promoted. I remember at that time, to use a credit card in a grocery store had a social stigma. But now, many people here rarely use cash. What are the credit card interest rates in Germany? (In the US credit card interest rates can be 20-30%). Maybe there's less incentive to promote use of ca…

I don't even know what is the rate on my credit card. I use it all the time. I just pay back the full amount every month. I think that's the best way to use it. You don't need to carry cash. You don't need to pay interest.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#209

Post by burkemw3 » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:58 PM UTC

dublinben wrote: post #41

thinkMOAR wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

whats the fine print for your 1-3% cash back? wondered about that. Will you be sharing (allowing the card issuer) to sell meta data of your transactions?

With most credit cards, your entire purchase history (sometimes including item-level data) is for sale to data brokers and advertising companies. It's a high price for that 1-3% cash back.

In addition to selling purchase history, CC companies may also be (at least partially) funding the rewards with transaction fees.

Some cards (e.g. Amazon Store Card) get you relatively high rewards at a specific vendor (Amazon). I predict there are special deals in place with the banks/transaction processors involved that make these rewards more possible.

Re: Why Germans pay cash for almost everything

#210

Post by 101km » Tue, Aug 08, 2017, 3:58 PM UTC

lmm wrote: post #132

djtriptych wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Always carry enough cash to get home" - my dad. But otherwise I'm in the same boat. Amex for everything I can possibly use it for, Visa for places that don't take Amex, Visa debit when I'm under a CC limit.

> "Always carry enough cash to get home" - my dad. In London you can't pay for a bus with cash any more.

You can still buy the oyster card with cash however, right?

Now try catching a bus late at night after the shops close - what a silly system.