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Talos II

raptorcs.com

61–70 of 110 posts

Re: Talos II

#61
post #8
post #5

Prices starting at $4,750 [sic]: https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2WK2/purchase.html

That price does not include RAM or a GPU. Even a bare bones motherboard costs more than $2,000. I have no doubt this an awesome machine, but that price puts it outside my budget range. :(

The price of the mainboard is almost divided by 2 compared to Talos 1, but the workstation bundles are as expensive or even more.

I bet it will fail as Talos 1 did, for the same reason: way too expensive for what it is, for the concerned/hobbyist audience, leaving it for a tiny part of the professional audience... which is not ready either to put their trust in an unreliable project and prefers safe bets.

Re: Talos II

#62
post #48
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're in the US, your debit card is likely a Visa or Mastercard debit card.

I'm in the UK, and every debit card I've ever had has been a Visa or Mastercard

For contrast, I'm Swiss, and all of my debit cards have either been Maestro or PostFinance (in Switzerland, the Postal Service runs a bank which maintains its own debit card scheme).

Maestro is technically a MasterCard debit card, but I'm not aware of a possibility to use it for online payments. VPay (i.e. "proper" VISA debit) is starting to make inroads.

Re: Talos II

#63
post #41

I applaud them for pricing the board at around $2000 (though with the CPUs it's obviously more expensive). This sits squarely within my budget for a high-performance and trustworthy workstation like this (even accounting for taxes). However I would also have payed for faster CPUs (up to ~$1000 each for an 8- or 12-core processor). Does anyone know if all POWER9 processors fit into that socket, and if yes, if there is…

> Like many fellow Europeans I don't have a credit card, so if that is the only way to pay, I'd have to jump through a lot of hoops to buy this. Why would that be the only option? Never seen a shop accept credit cards only. I only have a debit card and have never had any problems.

I think this is a common misunderstanding. The US seems to use "credit card" to refer to all payment cards, but is rarely limit to just _credit_ cards.

I think the distinction between credit and debit cards is more commonly made in Europe.

Re: Talos II

#64
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the info... what's a better/the best option? Also, this is a laptop, so a diff class than server/desktop models - so may not be fair to even compare them ?

Don't take my comment to mean that Purism is evil, just that you aren't getting some ironclad security guarantee. This explains the "controversy" better than I can ( http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960524/laptop-computers/why-... ). Purism is certainly a step up from Lenovo that was shipping computers with rootkits installed. If you wear a tinfoil hat then you're going to be better off with a libreboot laptop, but yo…

So just to be 100% clear, and for the edification of everyone (myself included);

It is literally safe to assume that every single device is 100% compromised and the 5eyes, can if they wish, monitor every single thing you do, based on these issues, correct?

But then, you also have to think that every service that you use, outside of your own 100% controlled purview (I.e. Literally any cloud service) is also summarily compromised to the point that you cannot say that one is completely secure...

Would this be safe to say?

Re: Talos II

#65
post #52
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There are alternatives that are cheaper and work just as fine. Do you have an example? Debit cards have very similar cost structures, cash is more expensive to handle.

Lastschrift works fine for me.

And you can use that to buy goods online? Direct debit is usually used for recurrent billing. In Portugal there's a way to use a similar system for online purchases by generating a code that you then have to use in an ATM or online banking. It makes for a pretty poor customer experience when purchasing and I doubt it's actually cheaper these days than debit/credit payment processing.

Re: Talos II

#66
post #22

It seems they're not all that interested in marketing to end users, despite the talos ii "bare-bones" kit available for pre-order on the site - I couldn't find any reviews of the previous talos I/power8 system online - i would assume they'd at the very least get someone like anadtech, ars or one of the many Linux journals to do some hands-on testing / free marketing? I mean, if I had too much cash, I'd be tempted to…

I don't think Talos I was ever released. They created a backlash last time by hyping an unavailable and unaffordable product so maybe the low-key approach is better.

Re: Talos II

#67
post #66
post #22

It seems they're not all that interested in marketing to end users, despite the talos ii "bare-bones" kit available for pre-order on the site - I couldn't find any reviews of the previous talos I/power8 system online - i would assume they'd at the very least get someone like anadtech, ars or one of the many Linux journals to do some hands-on testing / free marketing? I mean, if I had too much cash, I'd be tempted to…

I don't think Talos I was ever released. They created a backlash last time by hyping an unavailable and unaffordable product so maybe the low-key approach is better.

I don't know, if they don't have any units the can give out to do tests on at this point, what are the odds that the whole thing isn't another round of vapourware? I hope I'm wrong.

[ed: That is to say, if they couldn't get the one tested because it didn't exist, they should be twice as hard at work getting the mk II tested - and I can't see any evidence of that either.]

Re: Talos II

#68
post #41

I applaud them for pricing the board at around $2000 (though with the CPUs it's obviously more expensive). This sits squarely within my budget for a high-performance and trustworthy workstation like this (even accounting for taxes). However I would also have payed for faster CPUs (up to ~$1000 each for an 8- or 12-core processor). Does anyone know if all POWER9 processors fit into that socket, and if yes, if there is…

> Like many fellow Europeans I don't have a credit card, so if that is the only way to pay, I'd have to jump through a lot of hoops to buy this. Why would that be the only option? Never seen a shop accept credit cards only. I only have a debit card and have never had any problems.

Depending on the merchant and the bank, debit cards might not work. For example, the debit card from my bank will not work if used to pay at Amazon (allegedly the bank is too strict about payment details and Amazon doesn't provide something). I had to get a credit card specifically because of this (the debit card works everywhere else I tried it).

Re: Talos II

#69
post #51
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Either the merchant agreements forbid charging credit card fees, or it's just a norm that our businesses have adopted (over here we strongly believe in the advertised price being the actual price - we don't have tax-added-on-afterwards or mail-in rebates like in the US), but either way you very rarely get charged a fee directly. Some places will have a minimum spend to pay by credit card, and low-end shops won't acce…

> for most the card fees are built into the prices that you pay even if you're paying cash. That is unfair, and not all businesses do that. I criticize it and prefer shops that don't.

Remember cash isn't free either - armoured cars and the like cost money, I wouldn't be surprised if the overall work involved in handling cash ended up being more costly than card fees.

I guess I don't object in principle to a cash discount (a card fee would annoy me), but those tend to exist for the sake of tax evasion, which I won't support.

Re: Talos II

#70
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't take my comment to mean that Purism is evil, just that you aren't getting some ironclad security guarantee. This explains the "controversy" better than I can ( http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960524/laptop-computers/why-... ). Purism is certainly a step up from Lenovo that was shipping computers with rootkits installed. If you wear a tinfoil hat then you're going to be better off with a libreboot laptop, but yo…

So just to be 100% clear, and for the edification of everyone (myself included); It is literally safe to assume that every single device is 100% compromised and the 5eyes, can if they wish, monitor every single thing you do, based on these issues, correct? But then, you also have to think that every service that you use, outside of your own 100% controlled purview (I.e. Literally any cloud service) is also summarily…

That's a rather strong way of putting it, but yes, you should assume that every device you use can be penetrated by a sufficiently advanced and motivated actor. You should also be comfortable with the fact that state level actors have been recording information so that they can reach into your past should you ever become a problem with them. In that mindset, you have to create a security environment such that the truly advanced actors aren't motivated enough to bother with you. At the same time, don't leave your front door wide open so that any teenager can walk in and steal your TV.

I'm personally not worried about the 5eyes (but anti-gov activists should be). I'm worried about the smart kid who can use metasploit to take the banking info off my laptop in the middle of the night without me knowing it. A Purism laptop doesn't protect me from the smart teenager any more than an HP does. Full disk encryption and a Yubikey probably does, along with a decent firewall. Using cloud services where I encrypt my data before uploading is better than one where I transmit unencrypted (or where the cloud service controls the key).

A company willing to drop several thousand dollars on a Talos II might be worried about corporate espionage, so they might be willing to pay for a verifiable bios.

The NSA has to worry about thousands of hackers from dozens of countries around the world, so they are willing to pay for custom silicon.

Of course, you also need to consider physical security, which is like this: https://xkcd.com/538/

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