I don't agree with the firing. This directly fuels the view point that free speech for liberals is valid as long as the views are palatable to liberals. Such things achieve nothing but pushes both sides further into their own echo chambers and the world into a deeper abyss. It sort of sends out a message that only certain viewpoints are allowed to be expressed freely. What we need rather is a fierce and open debate with views from all sides expressed freely.
Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
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Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#592Google really blew it. Just look at this conversation, normally happy and polite HN is barely restraining itself only because of fear of being hell banned and this is a tiny watered down version of the outrage they have unleashed nation wide. Had they just (as they should ethically have done) privately let the guy know "hey uh, independent of whether we agree with you, can you please cool it because this is USA, Bay…
I can't imagine the rage this has unleashed within google. Google will be fundamentally fractured internally because of this one decision.
Nay, Google was already fractured after Trump election TGIF and last holiday gift. It's popcorn time now.
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#593Google really blew it. Just look at this conversation, normally happy and polite HN is barely restraining itself only because of fear of being hell banned and this is a tiny watered down version of the outrage they have unleashed nation wide. Had they just (as they should ethically have done) privately let the guy know "hey uh, independent of whether we agree with you, can you please cool it because this is USA, Bay…
>hey uh, independent of whether we agree with you, can you please cool it because this is USA, Bay Area 2017 and you just can't say shit like that You make the Bay Area sound like a somewhat dystopian, closed and repressive place. Is it really like that?
I would count rows upon rows of homeless people in tents on the sidewalk next to where self-driving cars zoom by as pretty dystopian.
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#594Given the number of applications Google receives, I assume they receive far more candidates that "meet the bar" technically than they can ever possibly accept, as do top tier Universities with students who have stellar grades/test scores.
So like these Universities, Google must consider other factors they believe add uncommon value to the "campus" when choosing candidates, among which are ethnic and gender diversity. I believe the author is underestimating the value of this to Google's corporate culture and public image, and is probably overestimating the technical skill required to be a competent Googler.
That being said, I believe his firing will only raise the dissatisfaction of the (I'm sure many) employees that share his viewpoint or at least his right to express it.
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#595Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Diversity programs are not about lowering the bar As an Asian male who once upon a time had to apply to colleges, I'd like to see some evidence for that assertion. To be clear, I (and hopefully many other people commenting here) have no problem with outreach, anti-harrassment, and other such workplace training initiatives. It's unfortunate that we can't all achieve a baseline level of civility that abstracts away a…
I appreciate where you are coming from. And I agree we should, "strive towards a world in which we stop making exactly those kinds of distinctions and instead judge people on the content of their character and the value they can create." And I honestly believe that diversity and outreach programs are part of that process. The economic and social structure of the United States is the result of historical processes tha…
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Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#596This is starting to be scary. Instead of government companies are acting as thought police. I think a lot of people will watch what they are saying publicly from now on.
He puts his employer in a very difficult situation, however Google reacts, it is going to be trigger half of the internet population.
He is hired to be a programmer, not a social activist and Google surely could stand up and say they don't want be part of that.
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#597This feels like the blue and black (white and gold) dress. It boggles my mind that people don't see the fundamental and toxic misogyny in this 'manifesto'. Please have a woman you care about in your life, preferably one in tech, read this and then ask their opinion of the piece. The "treat people as individuals, not as just another member of their group" sentiment of the author is fine except that we have hundreds of…
> Diversity programs are not about lowering the bar As an Asian male who once upon a time had to apply to colleges, I'd like to see some evidence for that assertion. To be clear, I (and hopefully many other people commenting here) have no problem with outreach, anti-harrassment, and other such workplace training initiatives. It's unfortunate that we can't all achieve a baseline level of civility that abstracts away a…
> as long as we continue to perpetuate diversity practices that emphasize sex and race in any way, some classes of people are going to be harmed
The whole reason diversity practices exist is because "some classes of people" are already being harmed. Without "diversity practices", we already have practices that emphasize and discriminate sex and race, except they happen to be the status quo.
Attacking diversity for harming "some classes of people" misses the point, because any change to the status quo is necessarily going to harm certain classes and benefit other classes.
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#598"Mr. Damore, who worked on infrastructure for Google’s search product, said he believed that the company’s actions were illegal and that he would “likely be pursuing legal action.” “I have a legal right to express my concerns about the terms and conditions of my working environment and to bring up potentially illegal behavior, which is what my document does,” Mr. Damore said." The guy apparently has decided to clever…
Do we know where Martin Shkreli was during all this?
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#599This feels like the blue and black (white and gold) dress. It boggles my mind that people don't see the fundamental and toxic misogyny in this 'manifesto'. Please have a woman you care about in your life, preferably one in tech, read this and then ask their opinion of the piece. The "treat people as individuals, not as just another member of their group" sentiment of the author is fine except that we have hundreds of…
>Please have a woman you care about in your life, preferably one in tech, read this and then ask their opinion of the piece. Do you have any women in tech in your life? Did any of them actually read it? Disclaimer: I did not read the entire piece. From what I've seen over the past 24 hours, the vast majority of people with an opinion on it did not read all (or any) of it either.
Until very recently, almost no one has read the entire piece, because Gizmodo intentionally stripped out all the citations and charts the original author had in the document. Hmm. I can't imagine why....
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3914586/Googles-I...
Re: Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo
#600This feels like the blue and black (white and gold) dress. It boggles my mind that people don't see the fundamental and toxic misogyny in this 'manifesto'. Please have a woman you care about in your life, preferably one in tech, read this and then ask their opinion of the piece. The "treat people as individuals, not as just another member of their group" sentiment of the author is fine except that we have hundreds of…
>It boggles my mind that people don't see the fundamental and toxic misogyny in this 'manifesto'.
It boggles my mind that ANYONE sees "toxic misogyny" in this document. I saw really offensive internal emails directed at this guy. Are you really so sure you're on the right side? I'm not asking if you think you have the right ideology, I'm asking you if you think you're still on the right side.