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“Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

businessinsider.com

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Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#201

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

pault wrote: post #104
1024core wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I changed the positions because the workload was so low I knew someone who basically took full advantage of this. He was a contractor too, but just added a clause that he'd be allowed to work from home/remotely. So he was doing multiple gigs simultaneously; so instead of making $100/hr (or thereabouts, I'm not sure about the exact numbers), he was making $400/hr. It's probably not legal to do what he was doing, but…

I'm curious if people that do this ever get a "perfect storm" of all clients having unplanned work at the same time. It sounds great in theory but I feel like it would just tangle you up in a web of lies.

> I'm curious if people that do this ever get a "perfect storm" of all clients having unplanned work at the same time.

That is why it is a good idea to make the acquaintance of some subcontractors that you can further contract the work out to if a "perfect storm" happens.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#202

Post by iandanforth »

muzz wrote: post #80
johan_larson wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clarification: "Senior SWE", the formal rank, at Google is indeed a plausible terminal level. If you get there, they'll let you stay indefinitely. But it isn't particularly senior. If you start at Google straight out of college, it's two promotions up, and you may not have supervised anyone higher than an intern.

Yes, but: 1) promotions are not particularly easy. they are approved by committee, ie not because a manager happens to favor an employee 2) Senior SWE itself is an Individual Contributor role (some say the optimal level if one wants to remain an IC). Only at the next level is leadership required 3) There is a HUGE jump in compensation between Senior SWE and the next level (Staff). Senior SWEs are not pulling anywhere…

Perspective for those outside of CA, to be in the top 1% you need to be making in excess of $450k / year.

Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/top-one-percent-every-us-stat...

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#203

Post by imron »

pdimitar wrote: post #118
joejerryronnie wrote: post #117

Or, as a recently bought out/retired colleague remarked, "My job now consists of being home all day and trying not to piss off my wife" - a much harder endeavor than any engineering project I can think of.

Sounds like love and respect are long gone from that "relationship".

Or, it could have just been a joke.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#204

Post by throwaway7230 »

boulos wrote: post #49
johan_larson wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clarification: "Senior SWE", the formal rank, at Google is indeed a plausible terminal level. If you get there, they'll let you stay indefinitely. But it isn't particularly senior. If you start at Google straight out of college, it's two promotions up, and you may not have supervised anyone higher than an intern.

Thanks for that (as you surmised, I meant "senior" in the broad sense). For those following along, new college grads usually start at Level 3 ("SWE II"), and "Senior SWE" (Level 5) is considered "high enough". Explicitly the guidance for L5 is that: "All Google engineers are expected to reach this level".

Apple has a similar system: I've never met a level 1. Level 2 SWE is kind of entry level, level 3 is mid-career, level 4 is senior. It's pretty achievable to get promoted quickly up to level 4. Some people even come in at level 4 if they come in with experience. Unfortunately level 4 where most people's careers and raises (and stock, from what I hear) come to a screeching halt.

I understand there's a level 5 that takes about 10x the effort of going from 2 to 4. You need to be pretty much a world renowned wizard to get there. I think a SVP needs to approve 5's. The vast, vast majority of SWEs will never make level 5, and managers are discouraged from promoting people to 5 unless they are super ultra mega stars.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#205

Post by madengr »

doktrin wrote: post #88
lisper wrote: post #34

It's not just SV that has this phenomenon. I worked at the NASA Jet Propulsion Lab from 1988 to 2000. I had risen to the rank of Senior Member of the Technical Staff, the second-highest rung on the technical career ladder. Beyond that there is the rank of Principal, which is very hard to attain. It's essentially the equivalent of getting tenure. It requires peer review. Most engineers never attain it, and I was not o…

I worked at another FFRDC, and had a similar experience. MTS-A (the equivalent of 'Principal' at JPL, I assume) was basically reserved for lifers. Likewise, the promotion requirements for engineers was the same for that of researchers (i.e. published white papers, presentations at academic conferences, etc.) - and was not particularly well mapped to any actual day to day work done by engineers.

One of the labs?

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#206

Post by madengr »

pault wrote: post #104
1024core wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I changed the positions because the workload was so low I knew someone who basically took full advantage of this. He was a contractor too, but just added a clause that he'd be allowed to work from home/remotely. So he was doing multiple gigs simultaneously; so instead of making $100/hr (or thereabouts, I'm not sure about the exact numbers), he was making $400/hr. It's probably not legal to do what he was doing, but…

I'm curious if people that do this ever get a "perfect storm" of all clients having unplanned work at the same time. It sounds great in theory but I feel like it would just tangle you up in a web of lies.

There was play about that; a guy dating 3 stewardesses, then commercial jet flight is introduced, and he has to juggle them all until his scheme crashes down. Pretty damn funny play.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#207

Post by pdimitar »

hosh wrote: post #182
pdimitar wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ain't buying it. I don't know the concrete person, that's a fact. I spent my younger years in much more social jobs compared to programming in cubicles (thank the gods I work remotely for 5+ years now) and out of probably 200+ men I've heard joking about horrible wife and kids, I can assure you no more than 5 were really joking. And I don't mean offhand conversations -- I am talking about people who I've chatted wi…

I buy it. Relationships are hard and marriages are harder, even for partners trying to make things work. It was shocking to me that my friends who are married also have their own struggles. In hindsight, it is normal. I used to think, "well, those guys should have a better marriage", and now I realize how difficult it actually is, and how widespread. The parents from Rick & Morty? Yeah. My wife and I had tried a lot…

Not sure I follow. Your reply reads like "marriage is yet another job, you must invest the proper amount of hours in it". If so, I disagree.

If not, what were you trying to say? And apologies if I misread your comment.

In general, I agree with the notion that relationships need "work" -- but in my case the "work" is basically not allowing certain relationship entropy events to ever happen (or to never last more than a few days). Me and my wife are real and sometimes brutal with our honesty with one another, we're down-to-earth and [mostly] humble, and we never, EVER, go to sleep angry at each other. That "formula" has worked wonders so far.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#208

Post by madengr »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #85

And they wonder why house prices in the bay area are so high. :-( I started work at Sun Microsystems on the Monday after they had IPO'ed (the previous Friday). It was about a year later when all of the various restrictions on personal stock sales had been lifted that I clued in that some people just didn't care any more about work and it was quietly explained to my shocked ears that these people were now multi-millio…

I had $30k in Sun stock at one time; lost it all.

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#209

Post by krallja »

madengr wrote: post #206
pault wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious if people that do this ever get a "perfect storm" of all clients having unplanned work at the same time. It sounds great in theory but I feel like it would just tangle you up in a web of lies.

There was play about that; a guy dating 3 stewardesses, then commercial jet flight is introduced, and he has to juggle them all until his scheme crashes down. Pretty damn funny play.

"Boeing, Boeing"

Re: “Rest and vest”: engineers who get paid and barely work

#210

Post by mathattack »

pdimitar wrote: post #118
joejerryronnie wrote: post #117

Or, as a recently bought out/retired colleague remarked, "My job now consists of being home all day and trying not to piss off my wife" - a much harder endeavor than any engineering project I can think of.

Sounds like love and respect are long gone from that "relationship".

If you disappear for 7 or 8 years to dedicate yourself to the next few versions of Windows, don't be surprised that your spouse is a stranger.
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