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Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

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Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#41
You’re facing the exact problem I am right now in my life.

I am 21, and work in the same Technologies you do. I founded a company in web services a year ago (http://Bigdrop.io) which is pretty much self sustainable today. I don’t find a lot of interest in the domain any more and tire of new projects easily.

I however realised that my true passion lies with creativity, and it isn’t limited to the web or to programming.

I am currently working with India Accelerator ( http://indiaaccelerator.co ), which gives me the chance to interact with start ups, discuss and design products, play a high level technical role, meet new people, etc.

We could possibly come up with something to help you out, you can reach out to me. naved@bigdrop.io

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#42
If you're still interested in tech but want to move away from programming there are definitely options. A few I've seen before: - moving to a product/project management role (more talking to people and a lot less coding) - a hybrid sales/engineer role on a technical product (helping the sales team and customer figure out how the product can be most useful to them) - Developer support for a technical product (v.useful to have engineers who like communicating externally in these roles)

Otherwise people career change entirely. E.g. I studied law at university, realised I didn't want to be a corporate lawyer, then did sales/vc work at an equity crowdfunding start-up, left there to learn to code, spent just over a year building prototypes & on contract in some bigger tech co's, then started my own co which I'm now a year into (I'm 25).

So try and work out what interests you and see if you can move within the company you're at to start with to test it out.

I also wrote up the transferable skills from law > programming. It definitely goes the other way too - https://hackernoon.com/how-studying-law-helped-me-with-progr...

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#43

I felt like that a few years ago. I didnt end up leaving my career, what i did instead was use my skills in a different way. Instead of being a web developer, i became a business consultant. Like you i didnt care about the latest fashion in the space and in general my interest was no longer in programming, however, 60%-80% of my time today is still writing code, but i'm much happier. What i do now is i work with non-…

Can you speak to how you initially made the move and got clients, and how you get them now?

My question exactly. I would think there are millions of opportunities like this out there, but my gut feel is that any company that has any sort of a budget for a project would already have some sort of an IT department who would very carefully protect their "environment" (read: jobs) from any sort of an external entity who would introduce efficiency.

This may seem like a conspiracy theory to some, but it is extremely consistent with my observations from over 20 years in the industry. I see inefficiency and incompetence everywhere I look, I simply cannot believe this is mostly accidental, there must be forces acting to keep things this way.

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#44

The glory days of programming are over, mate. When the masses discovered programming to be profitable ~5 years ago, it became "cool" and was quickly gamed into the ground from both ends. Look at what "cool" does to art and music. The "rockstars" get paid a lot, and everyone else works for peanuts (or no nuts) or gets a "real job". 90% of the work now is marketing yourself. So it is with programming. Programming is li…

There is some truth to it. Everyone wants a developer with extensive public portfolio (github/stack overflow/open source contributions) and ideally great performance with algorithmic brain teasers, but don't realize that such people are quite literally celebrities. Do you really need George Clooney for your soap opera? Is the budget of your soap opera sufficient to hire George Clooney? Another thing - for the dirty stuff the celebrity will need a double;)

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#45
I started TAing last year and moved up to teaching just recently at a coding bootcamp after realizing I really enjoy working with people in that way and that I have some aptitude for it. Really enjoying it, it's part time on top of a dev day job at the moment but I know people who do it full time and make good money.

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#46

I felt like that a few years ago. I didnt end up leaving my career, what i did instead was use my skills in a different way. Instead of being a web developer, i became a business consultant. Like you i didnt care about the latest fashion in the space and in general my interest was no longer in programming, however, 60%-80% of my time today is still writing code, but i'm much happier. What i do now is i work with non-…

Ok since in less than an hour i've had a few comments and 1 email asking about this, i'll reply here.

So the headlines are: Be as boring as possible, Networking, Focusing on the outcome, rather than the product and start studying business instead of tech.

Be as boring as possible

Tech to tech guy is sexy, i avoid the sexy, because thats where all the other techys are, you know where they're not, boring businesses. When i say boring i dont actually mean they're boring, i find them interesting, they're just not considered fashionable and sexy and the "in-thing". If you go through life like i do, as a customer wondering why a difficult process isnt made easier using technology, then you already know what you can go after. I rent cars quite often, car rental companies have to take my details EVERY SINGLE TIME! Why dont they have a system that looks up my info for next time? The local chamber of commerce runs free business workshops, you can even register online, however after the workshop, they give you the slides on paper, ask you to fill out a feedback form on paper and that paper asks for your email address if you want to hear more? Why isnt the first part married with the second part? My local council that does my refuse collection required me to phone them, get a paper form posted to me, i had to fill it out, post it back, then pay over the phone, then i had to go to the local office to collect my trade waste bags? SERIOUSLY???

There are SO MANY boring problems out there that can be made better, its all LOW HANGING FRUIT, why? Because most of the tech world is making a salt dispensing centerpiece for the dining table that has an app for your iphone to pick how many pinches of salt you need, oh and bluetooth! https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/smalt-the-world-s-first-i...

Networking

Go to your local networking meetups, don't go to any tech ones. Go to ones for Oil and Gas, Construction, Local Government, Textiles, Motor vehicles, etc. Find and talk to people there, be helpful, give away your knowledge for free. Establish yourself an an authority on making business processes better. Join your local chamber and volunteer your time to grow their membership, this will not only benefit them, you can develop some software to make the process easier, they get to use it for free and you get exposed to their membership, also, you can sell this software to other chambers in the area. (We're doing exactly this.)

Focus on outcome, rather than the product

Your business client does care about code quality, or test coverage, or continuous integration, or git branching methodology. Just write the damn app and make it look pretty. Write it well and secure, but dont spend time on shit that wont ever be appreciated by anyone but you. Deliver it, show them you just saved them £XXX,XXX per year now they use your software and they'll love you forever.

Study business, not tech

Read business books, read Patio11's blog, especially the one about not calling yourself a programmer, realise that what you are delivering is value, not exchanging your time for money. Charge accordingly, I recently charged £16,000 for about 5 days of work from my junior developer and about 3 days of work from me, why? Because it was for Kodak and the tool allowed their salespeople to make more sales by displaying pretty graphs for their clients. The value to them was easily 6 figures a year. This was through a middleman, and i know he charged a lot more than i did.

Sorry for the wall of text, i could talk for hours on the subject.

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#47
I'm someone who really values other people's company and the outdoors but maybe the reason I do so much is because I have mainly earnt money from working as a developer for the last 10 years. E.g. the job has low levels of this so I desire it more. I have, and still, would like to change career from programming.

I've tried other things including: landscape gardening. Pros: - Outdoors - Get fit - Learn handywork skills

Cons: - Poor pay - Still low level of people interaction - Not that interlectually engaging

Mountain bike guide

Pros: - Outdoors - Exciting - People interaction - Nice landscape - Following a passion I have

Cons: - Turns my passion into work - Low interllectual engagement - Poor pay

I also tried running my own company doing this which was a good experience. Problem with it was that it is difficult to make as much money comparing to programming. Also above points apply.

Photographer

Pros: - Outdoors - Technical - Creatively engaging

Cons: - Loads of digital images you have to work with becomes a bit of a burden - Regularity of work - Amount of competition

Writer / Blogger

Pros: - Fun - Built the blog so learnt web development - Good for learning content marketing

Cons: - Difficult to make money - Really competitive - Lots of alone time (I wrote a few books) - Effort/ reward ratio can be quite low

Estate Agent

Pros: - Met people - Look round lots of houses - Out on the road

Cons: - Pay - Image - Office based - Can be boring

Exhibition worker (technical support, building the stands)

Pros: - Travel (I worked in UAE, Paris, London) - Working with your hands - Money can be good

Cons: - Can make a lot more money as the event organiser - Long hours - Intense

Artist

Pros: - Travel (residencies around the world) - Meet interesting people doing interesting work - Intellectually engaging

Cons: - Difficulty to make a lot of money - Your lifestyle will be out of sync with anyone else doing a normal 9-5 - Snobbery - Networking

Designer

Pros: - Interllectually engaging - Many different disciplines (eg visual, service, UX, etc)

Cons: - Need a portfolio - Very competitive - Lots of low level crappy work if you cant get the interesting stuff

Teaching English

Pros: - Meet people - Command position of authority - Interesting, engaging work - Lots of opportunities to mix tech and education

Cons: - Money not as good as developer

That's my experience of other work, partly. Of course you can also try to make your career as a developer more interesting.

Ways I have tried to do this:

- Earn more money - Remote working - Change stack - Change scale, size, length of project, whether public or private sector - Develop other things not websites eg. a game - Get really disciplined about your dev time. Eg. work the way where you can be the more productive, get a pomodoro timer, go outside, try different types of desks.

To conclude this rant, developer / programmer is one of the job roles of the age. Douglas Adams said something along the lines, that each era has its own new industrial revolution and you are lucky if you can make your living out of it. However, it poses challenges but it is new and everyone is in the same boat trying to make it work for them.

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#48
> involves lots of math, which I suck at

How I got over this was actually through learning applied math. I thought I sucked at it, too, but really I just never tried hard before.

What I liked about programming was formulating and solving problems. Not normally the act of writing code in and of itself (though that can be fun, too, every now and then). Learning more math lets you tackle more interesting problems, and there are more applications of fancy math than ML!

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#49
post #15

You have a ton of time, don't worry. I changed careers more than once between 20 and 30. To/from radically different fields. Besides that, your skill-set as a programmer is _much_ more than your choice of language/web framework. You have skills in: - Building things - Decomposing and solving abstract problems - etc.. And don't let a perceived lack of math skills intimidate you. This stuff is learnable, with effort an…

> That said, if programming is losing its luster, but you still enjoy software -- try product/project management. Good pay, and it's a very social job where your tech skills will be valued.

Do you have an opinion on how much of product management is politics and posturing, and how much is actually building good products? For example, one doesn't have to look very far to find substandard software and features on hundreds of highly trafficked sites or commercial products, yet I'm under the impression that getting a job where one would have the authority to fix these things would be next to impossible. (And yes, I absolutely understand that decisions are, or at least should be, first and foremost economic decisions, and subject to competing priorities. For example, just look at the positive cultural change Microsoft has undergone relatively recently, they are a good example of a company who has changed in respect to what I'm talking about.)

Re: Ask HN: Web developer and looking for a career change, what are my options?

#50

I felt like that a few years ago. I didnt end up leaving my career, what i did instead was use my skills in a different way. Instead of being a web developer, i became a business consultant. Like you i didnt care about the latest fashion in the space and in general my interest was no longer in programming, however, 60%-80% of my time today is still writing code, but i'm much happier. What i do now is i work with non-…

Ok since in less than an hour i've had a few comments and 1 email asking about this, i'll reply here. So the headlines are: Be as boring as possible, Networking, Focusing on the outcome, rather than the product and start studying business instead of tech. Be as boring as possible Tech to tech guy is sexy, i avoid the sexy, because thats where all the other techys are, you know where they're not, boring businesses. Wh…

Sorry for the wall of text, i could talk for hours on the subject.

We are all sitting on the edge of our seats, waiting for you to launch your blog.

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