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Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

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Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#411

Post by arximboldi »

Veratyr wrote: post #328
WikipediasBad wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you mean coders on patreon itself? Any links to coder patreons I can look at? Or do you mean a new startup that's patreon for open source/coders? It would be really interesting to build a patreon platform tailor made for coders if the market for it is not already taken by patreon.

> Do you mean coders on patreon itself? Yes, they're on Patreon proper. Patreon isn't constrained to entertainment. > Any links to coder patreons I can look at? A few I know or Googled: - https://www.patreon.com/bcachefs - Works on a new filesystem - https://www.patreon.com/cemu - A WiiU emulation project - https://www.patreon.com/ShareX - An open source Windows application for sharing stuff - https://www.patreon.com…

Shameless plug: https://www.patreon.com/sinusoidal

I just opened it a couple of days ago, still have to polish the story and probably be more active on social media (I don't have Twitter, etc... I really despise Twitter but I kind of feel I am missing huge opportunities to get visibility...)

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#412

Post by astrostl »

vetinari wrote: post #156
chrisoverzero wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've seen Patreon kicking people off their platform for political reasons […] Have you? Are you thinking of Lauren Southern? Or maybe It's Going Down? The explanation from Patreon is very reasonable: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmcK6GvgVPs

Sorry, but "we don't need evidence, our imagination is enough" is not anywhere near "very reasonable". The free speech is not necessary for the speech you agree with. It is for the speech, you don't agree with. Just because Patreon guys are fans of Antifa does not mean, they should bring their ideology to the business.

I hadn't heard of her, or defend Europe, or this controversy, or anything. Watched the Patreon explanation video, which seemed pretty damn convincing, objective, and evidence-based to me.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#413

Post by smcnally »

PKop wrote: post #42
pillowkusis wrote: post #7

I have seen so many content creators go full time and create awesome work because Patreon gives them a format to incentivize their followers to pay them. The economics are beautiful — turns out just 1,000 people (a pittance on internet mass media websites) donating $5 a month will totally change the way you run your life. And even better, these artists are independent in a way no artist has ever been before. You’re n…

I've seen Patreon kicking people off their platform for political reasons, so it is not decentralized, though certainly more so than alternatives existing before Patreon. The evolution will converge towards content creators being funded through decentralized crypto currency platforms so that the money cannot be prevented from getting to creators if someone wants to pay them. Something more along the lines of https://…

> The evolution will converge towards content creators being funded through decentralized crypto currency platforms so that the money cannot be prevented from getting to creators if someone wants to pay them.

http://steemit.com is an example of precisely this. Will check out lbry.io.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#414

Post by bluthru »

learc83 wrote: post #397
bluthru wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>And it's most definitely illegal. Under what jurisdiction? >The rediculous part is that she was there to supposedly stop "human trafficking", but her and her boatmates were chanting "no illegal immigration" the entire time. In this case it's one in the same. The vast majority of these people aren't refugees: http://i.imgur.com/WCBSbMP.png https://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/12FDB/producti... The vast major…

>Under what jurisdiction? You're seriously arguing about the legality of using your boat to attempt to block a ship from leaving a harbor? I'm going to leave it to you to find the law the coast guard believed the violated when they arrested them. I don't speak Italian, so you have at it. >Wrong. The Chief Prosecutor of Catania, Sicily thinks so: And he's a far right politician who has zero evidence. After he made tha…

Sorry, I can't allow your falsehoods to stand. You're letting ideology get in the way of facts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhVIoj2tYtw

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/most-european...

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#415

Post by dave84 »

sqeaky wrote: post #204
dave84 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we did we might not keep them as pets.

We created dogs, they have no natural place in the wild before them the canids were Wolves and Coyotes.

We sure as hell didn't create them to be locked in an apartment all day listening to NPR while we work.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#416

Post by type0 »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #368
cookiecaper wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sticks and stones can break my bones, but words can never hurt me". This old cliche is underappreciated in our day and age. Individuals are free to choose the way they process the information and commentary they receive. When someone physically assaults you, there is no choice involved, and your life is legitimately and immediately threatened by such activity in the real, physical, and non-abstract sense. It is grea…

If only this were in any way true. There is a such thing as mental abuse, after all. Some folks lived through this growing up. Gaslighting is just words too. Folks kill themselves due to harassment. That harassment? Yeah, it can be nothing more than daily messages and/or phone calls and/or letters. Widespread, open racist speech generally signals an environment where racist actions are well-tolerated, I'm assuming (I…

How far do you want to take this? Criticizing someones religion might hurt their feelings but greatly benefit the society and democracy. Does it mean that critique of a religion or religious sects should be banned or should we just prohibit the critique or those which proponents are most vocal, intolerant or justifying to literally turn to violence about their religion?

I think that one should be clear here and distinguish between slander/defamation of a person and speech that "hurts someones feelings". If I criticize the ideas that you hold and it hurts your feelings it's is not a mental abuse if you start to interpret it that way it's your fault and should seek the psychiatrist. There is a real danger that we keep redefining words: hateful speech, mental abuse. Ideas are not people, religion is not an ethnicity, your beliefs are not sacred. What is a form of mental abuse btw is indoctrinating your (or someones) children, meaning religious schools are a form of mental abuse, sending your kids to a political party camp or enforcing your particular ideology on them is a form of mental abuse etc. But somehow everyone keeps ignoring it, it's not my kids so why should I care; I regard it as deeply hurtful for society.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#417

Post by type0 »

specialist wrote: post #394
Broken_Hippo wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only this were in any way true. There is a such thing as mental abuse, after all. Some folks lived through this growing up. Gaslighting is just words too. Folks kill themselves due to harassment. That harassment? Yeah, it can be nothing more than daily messages and/or phone calls and/or letters. Widespread, open racist speech generally signals an environment where racist actions are well-tolerated, I'm assuming (I…

I used to be a Chomsky-esque defender of free speech. Believing the correct response to Holocaust denial was refuting it, not banning it. But now we know better. How you talk changes how you think. Violent rhetoric normalizes that behavior. Refuting misbeliefs cements the falsehood. Propaganda works. Worse, the hate speech has become a virtue signal, a tribal identifier. It's become overtly political, a bludgeon. I n…

The problem is that we still keep labeling a satirical speech as a hate speech and it's getting worse.

> Violent rhetoric normalizes that behavior.

Consider "A Modest Proposal" where Swift normalizes eating babies http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

I see this trend as deeply disturbing where only those official journalist are allowed to write satirical essays online and common persons are banned because they become labeled as racists, mysogenists etc. Heck even PewDiePie was kicked from youtube red because some journalists blatantly mislabeled his satire as racism.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#418

Post by type0 »

Sleeep wrote: post #292
stale2002 wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" forcing people to listen is only going to worsen the situation you describe." Personally I don't think these companies should be legally forced to support freedom of discourse on their platforms by the government. I think that consumers should force the companies to support free speech, and they should punish companies that support censorship by boycotting those companies into bankruptcy. The world is a better plac…

I love censorship! Without moderation once a site gets big enough it devolves into the least common denominator - spam, shit posts, abuse, and trolling. See YouTube comments for one example. This site itself is highly censored (in the form of rules and moderation) so you aren't even upholding your own ideals by commenting here.

> highly censored

Not sure what you mean by highly censored, I've seen plenty of unpopular opinions on HN and people that were expressing them were never banned, in fact those users were fairly rude without being personal. Not allowing personal attacks on HN is not just a common courtesy, it protects it users from defamation, falsehoods about their life and kidnapping of topics; those are all reasons that are perfectly compatible with freedom of speech. Detaching a tread is not censoring, I never seen it happen because of uncomfortable opinions but when it becomes hugely off topic it's clearly a valid thing to do.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#419

Post by specialist »

type0 wrote: post #417
specialist wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to be a Chomsky-esque defender of free speech. Believing the correct response to Holocaust denial was refuting it, not banning it. But now we know better. How you talk changes how you think. Violent rhetoric normalizes that behavior. Refuting misbeliefs cements the falsehood. Propaganda works. Worse, the hate speech has become a virtue signal, a tribal identifier. It's become overtly political, a bludgeon. I n…

The problem is that we still keep labeling a satirical speech as a hate speech and it's getting worse. > Violent rhetoric normalizes that behavior. Consider "A Modest Proposal" where Swift normalizes eating babies http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html I see this trend as deeply disturbing where only those official journalist are allowed to write satirical essays online and common persons are banned because they become…

This debate, like most, has a bell curve distribution of positions. Two tails of snowflakes on either side, throwing tantrums, yelling at each other, and the majority in the middle who are tired of their shit.

Who's right? Who's wrong? I don't care. I'm fresh out of goodwill.

My only desire is that society stop enabling the bickering. Which will continue as long as clickbaiting (selling advertisement) makes money.

Re: Inside Patreon, the economic engine of internet culture

#420

Post by scaryspooky »

specialist wrote: post #263
azernik wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a very US-centric view of free speech. In many other (developed, democratic) countries, a lot of the shit 8chan does would be viewed as incitement to violence, hate speech, and/or invasion of privacy. The absolutist conception of free speech in the US is an outlier.

It's a very libertarian (puerile) view of free speech. The rest of us understand principles like civility, that your rights stop where mine begin, don't yell "fire!" in a crowded theater, balancing rights and responsibilities, and that hatespeech is a form of assault.

Except the entire founding of the US was based on violent "free speech" advocating the overthrow of an oppressive government. So up until fairly recently it was the norm to view speech, even violent speech, as aligning with the US Constitution.
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