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Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

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Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#91

Post by _jal »

evgen wrote: post #37
maaaats wrote: post #24

Guilty or not, this seems more like a kidnapping than an arrest. Can they really ignore all rights as they see fit?

Please outline the rights that were denied to him. The article that we are commenting about seems to have a completely deluded sense of what his rights are, but maybe we can start the discussion around his specific rights. Contra the original article, a 23 year-old does not have a fundamental right to talk to mommy and daddy once arrested. Law enforcement is under no obligation to arrest you as you arrive in country…

This is all generally true. It is also needlessly dismissive about concerns and naively sunny about the rights of arrestees and the respect LE in the US has for them.

But the key advice is Do. Not. Say. Anything. other than "bring my my attorney". Remember that in the interrogation game, the FBI gets to lie, but it is a felony for you. The FBI also refuses to videotape interrogations, gets to write the reports, and has played this game far more than you.

Add that up, and admitting that you like ice cream is dangerous. This can be especially dangerous for smart people, who will tend to start thinking about the questions, trying to guess where they're going, what is important. Don't. The rules are stacked against you, you're missing important information, and your interrogators are (probably) practiced experts at creating little set-piece dramas to manipulate you.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#92

Post by syshum »

dogma1138 wrote: post #86
syshum wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>He’s going to go through a trial by his peers No if he goes to trial it will be a trial with humans on the jury but that will be as close to his "peer" group as it will be 1. They will not be from his nation, but will be Americans 2. Most of them will likely be Computer illiterate, as the prosecution will excuse anyone that even owns a computer 3. They will like be older and outside of age peer group No it will not…

This is a silly argument. It's like saying that drug dealers should be judged by a jury made up of drug dealers and users. I don't think you understand what a "peer" means in this context. Trial by jury of your peers was implemented to prevent the church and royalty from judging the commons. Or to be more exact it's one of the first marks of separation of power; people who make up the law aren't the ones who also jud…

Well I would say drug dealing and using should not be a crime in the first place but that is off topic.

>Trial by jury of your peers was implemented to prevent the church and royalty from judging the commons.

I understand the purpose and you seem to have taken my comment to mean something it does not.

It is also ironic that you mention the church because given the geographic location where this trial will likely take place Ultra Religious people will likely be involved.

Further while I do not believe the jury should be made up solely of computer experts, I also do not believe computer experts should be excluded simply because they are experts in the subject matter of the trial which is what happens.

My biggest problem is around the process of jury selection.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#93

Post by niujhyt »

wildmusings wrote: post #56

The tech community's reaction to this is frankly laughable and embarrassing. The man has been accused of a crime. A grand jury has seen enough evidence to indict him. This is the United States of America, where as someone accused of a crime he will have more rights than he would in just about any other jurisdiction in the world.[1] Yet so many in this forum and elsewhere are spreading ridiculous conspiracy theories a…

Doesn't the US haven't the biggest prison population per head than any other country in the world?

From what I know of the US criminal justice system it is one of the worse in any democratic country.

Pretty sure that in the UK he would also have the right to remain silent, a fair trial, and also have illegally gathered evidence excluded. Quite the opposite of what happens a lot in the US.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#94

Post by LARGEGALAXY »

wildmusings wrote: post #56

The tech community's reaction to this is frankly laughable and embarrassing. The man has been accused of a crime. A grand jury has seen enough evidence to indict him. This is the United States of America, where as someone accused of a crime he will have more rights than he would in just about any other jurisdiction in the world.[1] Yet so many in this forum and elsewhere are spreading ridiculous conspiracy theories a…

Please wait one second, they ARRESTED him for COMMITTING a crime? Those racist, fascist bigots. Donald Trump must be to blame for this.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#95

Post by humanrebar »

escapetech wrote: post #43
humanrebar wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how those two are contradictory.

A guilt and redemption system focuses almost exclusively on the transgressions of the accused for the well being of society. An ethical system takes into account the well-being of everybody including the accused.

I'm confused if you're referring to the American judicial system in particular or some part of Western ethics in general.

In either case, I'm not clear what alternative is being proposed.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#97

Post by scandox »

wildmusings wrote: post #56

The tech community's reaction to this is frankly laughable and embarrassing. The man has been accused of a crime. A grand jury has seen enough evidence to indict him. This is the United States of America, where as someone accused of a crime he will have more rights than he would in just about any other jurisdiction in the world.[1] Yet so many in this forum and elsewhere are spreading ridiculous conspiracy theories a…

I'm sorry to have to tell you that American justice and law enforcement have a terrible reputation in Ireland and U.K. Whether that is justified I am not qualified to say. But at the very least you a huge PR problem.

The idea that anybody here would be saying "well thank God it happened in the USA" is literally laughable.

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#99

Post by wildmusings »

opaque wrote: post #89
wildmusings wrote: post #56

The tech community's reaction to this is frankly laughable and embarrassing. The man has been accused of a crime. A grand jury has seen enough evidence to indict him. This is the United States of America, where as someone accused of a crime he will have more rights than he would in just about any other jurisdiction in the world.[1] Yet so many in this forum and elsewhere are spreading ridiculous conspiracy theories a…

> He has the unqualified right to remain silent and to a jury trial in which illegally gathered evidence is excluded, neither of which he would have in the UK. Er... go easy on the patriotism, mate. We have those. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_silence_in_England_an... The US system also has flaws not present in our system (at least for now) e.g. Plea Bargains. https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/apr/27/trad…

>Er... go easy on the patriotism, mate. We have those.

Despite your snarky tone, you are mistaken. See my comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14935867

Re: Regarding Marcus Hutchins aka MalwareTech

#100

Post by humanrebar »

opaque wrote: post #89
wildmusings wrote: post #56

The tech community's reaction to this is frankly laughable and embarrassing. The man has been accused of a crime. A grand jury has seen enough evidence to indict him. This is the United States of America, where as someone accused of a crime he will have more rights than he would in just about any other jurisdiction in the world.[1] Yet so many in this forum and elsewhere are spreading ridiculous conspiracy theories a…

> He has the unqualified right to remain silent and to a jury trial in which illegally gathered evidence is excluded, neither of which he would have in the UK. Er... go easy on the patriotism, mate. We have those. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_silence_in_England_an... The US system also has flaws not present in our system (at least for now) e.g. Plea Bargains. https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/apr/27/trad…

I'm not sure plea bargains are a flaw in the system. It can be more humane to skip drawn out processes, public spectacle, and get on to the sentencing when the events are clearly criminal.

I'd like to see the number of actual trials and verdicts (guilty or not) go way up, though. If that's too expensive, then we should start repealing laws that are literally not worth enforcing.

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