The next wave of programming languages • Hacker News Board

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#71

Post by torial » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 3:56 AM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #14

Interesting languages not on the list: * io : http://www.iolanguage.com Clean, minimalistic, prototype based OO. * Reia : http://wiki.reia-lang.org Ruby-like syntax on Erlang's VM * Curry : http://www-ps.informatik.uni-kiel.de/currywiki Functional logic language : Prolog+Haskell. * Oz/Mozart : http://www.mozart-oz.org Multi-multi paradigm language, includes constraint based programming. Some of them are not necessari…

Cobra (http://cobra-language.com/), a python derivative that also an up and coming language. Love the syntax refinements, the built in unit-testing, contracts, etc... all around a great language.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#72

Post by billmcneale » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 4:49 AM UTC

j_baker wrote: post #13

Programming language authors really need to learn how to make a website. Look at Ruby's: http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/ No long explanations about what it means for Ruby to be a dynamic, object-oriented language. I don't have to read its author's paper or book to get it. Just a short code snippet to show me what it looks like and several links so I can learn more.

Another good example: http://fantom.org/

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#73

Post by billmcneale » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 5:02 AM UTC

acangiano wrote: post #8

zephyrfalcon wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but that picture on the website doesn't really make me want to try it, benefits of the language nothwithstanding... :-( ( http://bracha.org/Site/Newspeak.html )

Don't downvote him. He is absolutely right. The picture on that page is a major WTF and it doesn't offer a great first impression to the visitor interested in the language.

The copyright reads "Rachel Bracha". Probably a picture taken by his wife or daughter.

Terrible choice nevertheless.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#74

Post by billmcneale » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 5:05 AM UTC

RyanMcGreal wrote: post #22

I'm genuinely curious: what advantage accrues to a programming language designed for concurrency that you can't get with a good concurrency library for an existing language?

Not much, really, the benefits of intrinsic support for concurrency in languages are very overhyped.

Java is a great illustration: it has syntactically close to no support for concurrency (synchronized, pretty much) but it has been able to keep up with today's concurrency challenges by the simple virtue of its libraries (java.util.concurrent is very, very powerful) and ingenuity of its developers.

The amount of concurrent Java that powers major web sites and other places that we don't even know of is simply staggering.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#75

Post by mkramlich » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 6:31 AM UTC

Clojure and D are the two languages of the newer wave that I'm most likely to end up using. They each have a combination of elegance and practicality which are pretty rare among new languages I think.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#76

Post by pbiggar » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 7:41 AM UTC

joubert wrote: post #47

stcredzero wrote: post #42

The dynamic/compiled distinction needs to go away. Combine a simple syntax with very rapid compilation with LLVM, Type Inference, and very advanced emulator-based debugging, and there would be no need to have anything like Smalltalk/Perl/Python/Ruby any more. Instead of dynamic Duck Typing, you'd have Go's version, with auto-magic help from type inference. The emulator-based debugger could subsume many of the capabil…

The dynamic/compiled distinction needs to go away dynamic / compiled are orthogonal. CL is dynamic and gets compiled as you enter in the REPL.

Dynamic/compiled should be orthogonal, but rarely have been in practice. Witness PHP, Perl, Ruby, Lua, Python.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#77

Post by davidw » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 9:36 AM UTC

j_baker wrote: post #13

Programming language authors really need to learn how to make a website. Look at Ruby's: http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/ No long explanations about what it means for Ruby to be a dynamic, object-oriented language. I don't have to read its author's paper or book to get it. Just a short code snippet to show me what it looks like and several links so I can learn more.

I think the 37signals guys had a go at fixing it up some, or am I mistaken?

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#78

Post by regularfry » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 9:45 AM UTC

twopoint718 wrote: post #67

Scriptor wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think strlen is being accurate by saying its "Ruby fanboys" who are the source of a lot of criticism. Clojure does have a lot of former Java developers who aren't used to non-IDE development on the JVM. Others don't like the apparent complexity Emacs comes with (Emacs, Slime, Swank, Paredit? All I want to do is enter some ascii characters and run a compiler!) That said, I think Clojure is improving in those f…

I think there's at least one clojure plug-in for each of the main Java IDEs: Enclojure (NetBeans) Counterclockwise (Eclipse) La Clojure (JetBrains) The other thing that has really improved immensely is "project management" (right term?) provided by Leiningen. Now you can basically do "lein new proj_name", then edit a simple config file in the created directory and do "lein deps" to get all the packages that you refer…

Plus "lein swank," which once you've got slime set up is an absolute godsend. The two things I do first on a new machine are install clbuild to get slime and the emacs config, then leiningen to get clojure working. It does make things nice and simple.

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#79

Post by tomjen3 » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 10:51 AM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #29

I'll be there to talk about the D programming language.

Interesting, I kinda liked D, but I heard about it years ago and assumed it had died in the meantime.

Good to hear it hasn't.

Edit: I seem to be unable to find the actual license of the digital mars compiler - does anybody know where it is?

Re: The next wave of programming languages

#80

Post by tomjen3 » Wed, Jul 07, 2010, 10:52 AM UTC

billmcneale wrote: post #72

j_baker wrote: post #13

Programming language authors really need to learn how to make a website. Look at Ruby's: http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/ No long explanations about what it means for Ruby to be a dynamic, object-oriented language. I don't have to read its author's paper or book to get it. Just a short code snippet to show me what it looks like and several links so I can learn more.

Another good example: http://fantom.org/

Man that language is awesome - default nonnulable types, closures, mixins, static _and_ dynamic calls....

I am in love.