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Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

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Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#581
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a joke floating around somewhere (Matt Levine I think?) that one strategy to avoid a jury trial proceeding was to become so publicly infamous that it would be impossible to select an unbiased jury. Clearly didn't work out for Shkreli in this case.

It almost did, I believe it took something like over 200 potential jurors before they found a unbiased jury.

Well, arguably they didn't find an unbiased jury. They just found enough jurors who'd deny being biased.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So when are you planning to manufacture an equivalent device at lower price? Just sell it for $99, you'll crush Mylan and still earn 10x margins.

Between the FDA and patent lawsuits, good luck doing this in the US. Several major drug companies have already failed miserably and Adrenaclick isn't anywhere near the huge success you apparently think it would be. http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/08/29/reverse-voxsplaining-dr...

So are you saying it is not possible to provide an epipen equivalent at lesser price than mylan? Then what wrong are they doing again? It is literally not possible to sell the product at a lower price.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#583
Although technically true, the title is a bit misleading. He was acquitted from 5 of the 8 counts he was convicted of. Of the 8 counts, count 7 carried the biggest wait. This was in regards to the Retrophin securities fraud accusation where he was accused of a ponzi scheme amounting to over $10M. This was the only thing that would of brought him significant jail time but he was found not guilty. Count 7 carried more wait than all the other counts combined and was the heart of the case against him. Right now the case has gone from a felony to basically a parking ticket. All the articles talking about "facing 20 years" are sensationalist nonsense. That is a theoretical maximum. He will most likely receive NO jail time and will probably just have to pay a small fee. Of course you will not get any of this context from all the sensationalist headlines out there like "MARTIN SHKRELI FOUND GUILTY! FACING 20 YEARS PRISON SENTENCE!"...

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#584
post #5

I use to hate this guy, then I saw the Vice interview on him. It was nice to see his side of the story. I don't know much about this case in particular. It was kinda sleazy to see the congress question him about his price increases when they knew damn well it was perfectly legal and they haven't done anything to stop it. Shkreli seems to be trying to expose this hypocrisy, but the news loves their stories. Vice inter…

> Shkreli seems to be trying to expose this hypocrisy, but the news loves their stories.

Sociopaths love pointing out that they only hurt you because they wanted to make you stronger.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a jury trial that would absolutely sway things

Which, all things considering, is ridiculous. People shouldn't be able to be convicted because they're assholes (even if they are). I don't live in the US, but being convicted by a "jury of your peers" is frankly, ridiculous. When has the average person been able to grasp complex matters relating to say, securities fraud? Most people aren't even able to stay out of debt. A panel of judges with specialised experience…

The "jury of your peers" exists to provide a contextual moral component to the law. If your peers think you did no wrong, it doesn't matter what the letter of the law says: a crime that is justifiable to society deserves no punishment.

Conversely, if what you've done is not justifiable to society, you should be punished for it even if it is not a crime. The easiest way to understand this is when first-mover advantages run amok. If you're the first person to think of some dastardly evil, you should not be permitted to do it just because nobody has yet written a law prohibiting it. Like, say, the Coca-Cola Corporation is not innocent for putting addictive substances in their drinks simply because it wasn't illegal at the time. And Shkreli's price gouging doesn't sit well with anybody either. A person's ignorance about some harm does not constitute permission to commit that harm against them.

>When has the average person been able to grasp complex matters relating to say, securities fraud?

The defendant has an attorney whose job it is to explain these matters to the jury.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#586
post #554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SEC can only file civil actions. This is a criminal case, which can only be brought by the DOJ.

Either way. Not investors suing him.

Interesting point. Never realized the government has a monopoly on bringing criminal charges.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#587

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Between the FDA and patent lawsuits, good luck doing this in the US. Several major drug companies have already failed miserably and Adrenaclick isn't anywhere near the huge success you apparently think it would be. http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/08/29/reverse-voxsplaining-dr...

So are you saying it is not possible to provide an epipen equivalent at lesser price than mylan? Then what wrong are they doing again? It is literally not possible to sell the product at a lower price.

Well, Adrenaclick does exist and is cheaper, but I'll assume you meant "very hard" rather than "not possible".

It's hard because the US pharmaceuticals market is broken, something that Mylan is paying money to encourage now that they're on top. Have you read the post I linked to?

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sound quite a lot like Trump. "Just let it fail..."

Please don't make personal attacks on HN, especially politically charged ones.

Please don't litter HN all over various threads with your attempt to be a moderator.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have no clue what this court case was about, do you?

"Please don't insinuate that someone hasn't read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that.""

Please don't correct others' grammar and prose styles.

Re: Martin Shkreli is found guilty of securities fraud

#590

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting. I certainly hope he gets more time than I am expecting. Personally, my gut is saying 1-2 years. I'd be happy if he gets 4-6 like you expect. Definitely going to be interesting to hear the judges words during sentencing. I was listening to the Michelle Carter sentencing yesterday, as I was following that relatively closely. Now I'm waiting to see what happens here, but this is much more cut and dry t…

Why do you favor harsher sentencing for him? As a hedge fund manager, losing money is not illegal. The only illegal thing he did was lie about it so that he could get them their money back. It would've been perfectly legal for him to lose all his clients money in the hedge fund, make them aware of this fact, and reap the profits from his pharma business without dishing it out to his hedge fund clients. As far as I ca…

If you lie about the nature of an investment your fund is doing it is fraud, even if the investment you have secretly been doing turns out to be successful.
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