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LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

arstechnica.com

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Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#61

Post by burkaman »

freehunter wrote: post #51
dsacco wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a pretty literalist, one-size fits all approach to policy. I don't think it's a good framework to use for applying ethics considerations. If I can walk near a pool, should I also be able to run? Is running anything more than faster walking? If I'm allowed to be around the pool walking with my entry ID, should I also be allowed to place my ID on a little motorized car and make it dart around the pool really fas…

The pool has the right to kick you out, same as any website. The pool cannot call the police and charge you with a felony for misusing their resources.

The website can't really kick you out though, it can only kick your agent out and you can trivially create a thousand more. The website can politely ask you to stop just like the pool, but it can't actually do anything if you ignore it.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#62

Post by losteverything »

dsacco wrote: post #10

I'm following this story with a lot of interest. I've done (and still do!) a lot of data crawling/scraping. In the past I've worked on so-called "alternative data" collection and analysis for financial forecasting. Without going into too much detail, a lot of hedge funds have teams constantly searching for kernels of data that can contribute some kind of signal for market movements. This data can come in the form of…

I find scraping fascinating.

Are there "societies of scrapers"?

Inside, are certain sites more worthwhile - and which ones (eg reddit, eBay, trade union websites, whatever)

How about scraper brokers? Do they exist?

Are there scammy scrapers? Make up BS and sell as scraped data?

How big is this?

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#64

Post by graphitezepp »

mattm wrote: post #33

A perfect example of corporate hypocrisy. Both Facebook and LinkedIn did illegal things when they were younger but now that they are more established, they don't want anyone to do the same thing to them.

I mean that's just the standard way non altruistic entities interact with the law isn't it? Appeal to it when it benefits them, ignore it when it doesn't.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#65

Post by Spivak »

mbillie1 wrote: post #38
wccrawford wrote: post #5

>One plausible reading of the law—the one LinkedIn is advocating—is that once a website operator asks you to stop accessing its site, you commit a crime if you don't comply. I'm fine with that. But I'm also fine if they do the like the article suggests and require anything non-scrapable to be behind an account prompt, even if everyone with a account can access it. I don't think it's fair to make Linked In foot the bi…

> They shouldn't have to serve that content to people who aren't actually their users. So put it behind a password. It's not reasonable to expect to get only the benefits of publicly-searchable data without any of the drawbacks.

This is the crux of the issue, it's my impression that the CFAA doesn't have any language that sites have to take precautions to prevent unauthorized access.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#66

Post by huhtenberg »

hyperion2010 wrote: post #14

Ah, complaining when people look at the painting in your store front gallery on 5th avenue because you have to pay for the upkeep of the sidewalk.

Actually, no.

It's more like complaining about others selling tickets to view said painting from the sidewalk. HiQ repackages and sells data it scrapes from LinkedIn.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#67

Post by aantix »

Here's a few twists that would be interesting to see how they held up in court...

* What if someone had a few oDesk workers to manually enter in the LinkedIn data?

* What if someone wrote a scraper that parses the Google cache version of the public LinkedIn page?

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#68

Post by type0 »

haikuginger wrote: post #7
Tharkun wrote: post #6

"illegal"? Under what law?

The CFAA, which makes it a crime to access a computer system without proper permission.

My ISP give me permission to view the Web, probably so does the ISP which HiQ is using. Problem solved, no need to file any CFAA lawsuits.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#69

Post by occultist_throw »

dsacco wrote: post #10

I'm following this story with a lot of interest. I've done (and still do!) a lot of data crawling/scraping. In the past I've worked on so-called "alternative data" collection and analysis for financial forecasting. Without going into too much detail, a lot of hedge funds have teams constantly searching for kernels of data that can contribute some kind of signal for market movements. This data can come in the form of…

Well, it's pretty simple to legally dodge these kinds of threats.

If you scrape regularly, then pick up a dozen or more machines around the world, in less than friendly areas to US law. Pay with a rechargeable credit card or bitcoin. And the buy servers and set up a hadoop cluster that handles scan-jobs.

The worst case scenario is that LinkedIN, YELP, and others get some of your servers shut down. Wash, rinse, repeat.

EDIT: please note, this was only a thought-game to bypass rude and destructive laws like the CFAA, which weaponizes TOS'ses, EULA's, and other implicit contracts of adhesion (as in, you have to agree to see). Ideally, we would be better off with both these laws to have a sane scope, and for companies to not expect things to happen with content in public.

Re: LinkedIn: It’s illegal to scrape our website without permission

#70

Post by notfromhere »

aantix wrote: post #67

Here's a few twists that would be interesting to see how they held up in court... * What if someone had a few oDesk workers to manually enter in the LinkedIn data? * What if someone wrote a scraper that parses the Google cache version of the public LinkedIn page?

The oDesk thing is allowed, I believe. Or at least can't be detected
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