Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach • Hacker News Board

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#131

Post by rhblake » Thu, Jul 27, 2017, 6:51 PM UTC

yAnonymous wrote: post #127

rhblake wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, she was also fired (finally) and her career is finished. I agree it was monumentally stupid. But "punished as high treason"? Treason requires intent. She most certainly did not intend to be criminally disloyal to the country. Merely being ignorant and incompetent is not treason. This is a major fuckup but let's be real. Our country is a "joke"? I know complaining is a national sport in Sweden, much like in many…

>on the whole, things are in general pretty good, relative to most other countries in the world. 15 years ago, those relativizations wouldn't have been necessary. Sweden was a poster child of a good society and now it isn't. Many things in your country did deteriorate quickly over the last decade or so, no matter how you try to coat it. "At least we're still better than others" is a pretty sad statement by itself whe…

Are you sure you're not looking at the past through rose-tinted glasses? Not trying to coat anything, but I very well remember people talking about the country going down the drain 15-20 years ago too, following various incidents/attacks/scandals.

For sure some things have deteriorated (and others improved). So it goes. What are some of these things you believe have "quickly deteriorated"? (Genuinely curious)

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#132

Post by depressedpanda » Thu, Jul 27, 2017, 7:48 PM UTC

duncan_bayne wrote: post #93

staticelf wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait what? She knew that was a possibility and that it is highly illegal and still she went through with it. I would say that is having intent if anything. I love my country but I think she should be punished a lot harder. Arkebusering på slottsgården. But since that will never happen, 12 years in jail is probably enough.

Is that word from the same root as arquebus?

Yes, correct: https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arkebusering#Etymologi

Ultimately, both words come from low German "hakebusse".

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#133

Post by Yetanfou » Thu, Jul 27, 2017, 8:36 PM UTC

Hasknewbie wrote: post #87

raverbashing wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"unaccompanied minors" the ones that claim to be 17y.o. when they can get away with it?

I'm sure an overwhelming number of unaccompanied minor refugees are in fact adults claiming to be 17. /s

Sweden has started doing medical age tests on migrants who claim to be minors. The tests are still voluntary and the results are not binding in any way. The first results are in with the 'expected' results: 76% of those claiming to be minors are in fact over the age of 18. they tested 581 asylum seekers (96% were men, 4% women). 442 of them (430 men, 12 women) were over 18 according to the test results. 5 of them (all women) were possibly over the age of 18. 134 of them (133 men, 1 woman) were possibly under the age of 18. None of them were certainly under the age of 18.

So, yes, those who expected the majority to lie about their age have been proven correct.

https://www.rmv.se/aktuellt/de-forsta-medicinska-aldersbedom...

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#134

Post by depressedpanda » Thu, Jul 27, 2017, 8:41 PM UTC

depressedpanda wrote: post #25

Here's a summary of what foreign powers got access to: - identities of undercover operatives - personal identity data of everyone with a driver's licence - people with protected identities - location of all army vehicles - money transport vehicles - classified infrastructure information Even worse: when they realized they'd leaked photos, home addresses and SSNs of protected identities, they sent a clear text email a…

For those of you who got triggered by "feminist", please do note the quotes. I.e., it's their claim, not mine[1]. I personally don't see that they've done much for gender equality, so they only make that claim because it's fashionable.

In the end it doesn't matter how feminist a government is if it cannot properly rule a country, and their actions speak louder than empty words.

What I personally find so galling about the whole debacle isn't that Maria Ågren wasn't punished enough, but the signals the state sends to the people. She got away with a slap on the wrist, and she will continue to earn $14 000/month in the forseeable future[2].

If someone becomes a director general of a state agency their resonsibilities and culpability should increase with the salary. Criminal incompetence is still criminal, and should be prosecuted.

Instead, our government tried to bury the leak.

[1]: http://www.government.se/government-policy/a-feminist-govern... [2]: https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/maria-agren-plockar-ut-lo...

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#135

Post by depressedpanda » Thu, Jul 27, 2017, 9:04 PM UTC

willvarfar wrote: post #111

depressedpanda wrote: post #25

Here's a summary of what foreign powers got access to: - identities of undercover operatives - personal identity data of everyone with a driver's licence - people with protected identities - location of all army vehicles - money transport vehicles - classified infrastructure information Even worse: when they realized they'd leaked photos, home addresses and SSNs of protected identities, they sent a clear text email a…

I was with you for the first half, but the second half where you say the russians got stuff is silly and then the rant against 'feminist' government etc is just plain stupid.

One of the contractors who got access to the data was employed by the Serbian military for a decade. I suppose you are aware of the ties Serbia and its military has to Russia? It's not unprobable that this guy sold the information to Russia. Even if not, Sweden must treat a potential leak like this as a real leak, or else risk endangering their operatives.

Oh, yeah. The leak is _still_ ongoing: https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u...

More info here, with Google translated for your convenience: https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/07/swedish-t...

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#136

Post by yAnonymous » Fri, Jul 28, 2017, 9:49 AM UTC

rhblake wrote: post #131

yAnonymous wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>on the whole, things are in general pretty good, relative to most other countries in the world. 15 years ago, those relativizations wouldn't have been necessary. Sweden was a poster child of a good society and now it isn't. Many things in your country did deteriorate quickly over the last decade or so, no matter how you try to coat it. "At least we're still better than others" is a pretty sad statement by itself whe…

Are you sure you're not looking at the past through rose-tinted glasses? Not trying to coat anything, but I very well remember people talking about the country going down the drain 15-20 years ago too, following various incidents/attacks/scandals. For sure some things have deteriorated (and others improved). So it goes. What are some of these things you believe have "quickly deteriorated"? (Genuinely curious)

https://polisen.se/Global/www%20och%20Intrapolis/%C3%96vriga...

Your police have basically admitted that if worst comes to worst, they won't be able to uphold the law. 53 criminal zones, for a country like Sweden with relatively little police and military, are beyond managable.

We see the same in Germany, but people choose to ignore it. There are more and more areas in cities where you can't make use of your democratic liberties without being subjected to violence, mostly connected to muslim inhabitants that think their religion is above the law. We have more police and resources to cope with it, but it's reaching its limit.

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#137

Post by rhblake » Fri, Jul 28, 2017, 5:20 PM UTC

yAnonymous wrote: post #136

rhblake wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure you're not looking at the past through rose-tinted glasses? Not trying to coat anything, but I very well remember people talking about the country going down the drain 15-20 years ago too, following various incidents/attacks/scandals. For sure some things have deteriorated (and others improved). So it goes. What are some of these things you believe have "quickly deteriorated"? (Genuinely curious)

https://polisen.se/Global/www%20och%20Intrapolis/%C3%96vriga... Your police have basically admitted that if worst comes to worst, they won't be able to uphold the law. 53 criminal zones, for a country like Sweden with relatively little police and military, are beyond managable. We see the same in Germany, but people choose to ignore it. There are more and more areas in cities where you can't make use of your democrat…

The police identified 53 exposed zones, of which 15 are in the most serious category. It's indeed a big problem (hence this report and a lot of talk about it in Sweden).

At the same time I think a lot of people from countries where you really have areas you avoid as a citizen (say, the US) often get the wrong impression when they read about so-called "no go" areas. There's no area on this list that I would avoid going to. And I've been to many, many of them, and have friends/family living in many of them (nearly all violence is between criminals).

Again, not saying it's not a problem. It's a big problem. The police were given more resources in the latest gov't budget to deal with exactly this and will surely get more next year and it'll surely be an important topic in the 2018 election. We'll see how it goes.

What are some other things you think have quickly deteriorated? I'm interested in this outsider perspective.

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#138

Post by Yetanfou » Tue, Aug 01, 2017, 10:06 PM UTC

Yetanfou wrote: post #133

Hasknewbie wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure an overwhelming number of unaccompanied minor refugees are in fact adults claiming to be 17. /s

Sweden has started doing medical age tests on migrants who claim to be minors. The tests are still voluntary and the results are not binding in any way. The first results are in with the 'expected' results: 76% of those claiming to be minors are in fact over the age of 18. they tested 581 asylum seekers (96% were men, 4% women). 442 of them (430 men, 12 women) were over 18 according to the test results. 5 of them (al…

Just to get back with some new data points:

https://nyheteridag.se/nya-siffror-over-80-procent-av-testad...

Just over 83% is considered to be over 18, ~1% is likely to be over 18, 16% is possibly younger than 18.

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#139

Post by TrickyRick » Wed, Aug 02, 2017, 2:34 PM UTC

xlocicicig wrote: post #91

archevel wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I realy fail to see how being a "feminist" government has any bearing on the issue at hand. Sure the government screwed up, but the rant part just takes away from the valid points you've raised.

The screw-up was initiated by Alliansen (not the current government), by outsourcing this to IBM. I'm not saying current government are free of blame here, but please stop trying to fit this into a "feminist" argument.

I would assume you speak Swedish, based on your insight into Swedish politics, so here's a timeline of the events: http://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/detta-vet-vi-om-transportst...

Notice how it starts in 2015. The last election we had was in 2014 and that's when the change in government occurred. Check your facts, don't just parrot stuff you read on blogs :)

Re: Swedish Government Scrambles to Contain Damage from Data Breach

#140

Post by TrickyRick » Wed, Aug 02, 2017, 2:47 PM UTC

azinman2 wrote: post #23

"It said that the project manager for the outsourcing agreement admitted during questioning that “he had no knowledge whatsoever of how to ensure security.” You'd think someone would come in an consult on this, however, and setup basic protocols. A PM isn't expected to be a security expert -- that's what security experts are for.

That's what you get when the government pays 3/4 of private companies in salary. When you pay peanuts you get monkeys as they saying goes.

Also any type of consultancy work would probably have to go through "offentlig upphandling" which means the government puts out a proposal of what they want done and companies bid with the contract going to the lowest bidder. However someone has to formulate the requirements and that ends up going back on the original PM. Oh, and since the contract goes to the lowest bidder, what did you get when you payed peanuts?