Kind of a different use case, but I work on a web-based IRC client (self-hosted IRC cloud) and if Apple support service workers we could have improved offline support, push notifications (for mentions, disconnects, etc), on-device caching of embeds (links and images are embedded in-line), an improved loading screen, and more.
Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
361–370 of 451 posts
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#362Earlier quoted context omitted.
Disable it. It's a feature some people like and use. I like getting notifications from some services I use without needing to keep a browser window open on that page to get notified. And I like not having to download and install yet another flipping app to get that feature.
I cant imagine a service that you frequent enough to want push notifications but not enough that you would be willing to install a native app for a smoother experience.
Installing an app is not a smoother experience. Allowing notifications is one click. Also, apps don't always have the same features as websites. You also make the assumption that services I use with browser notifications also have apps. This is not true in the slightest. And in some cases, I still prefer the website over an app.
How is it hard to imagine a service I don't frequent use but when I do, I want notifications? I use these services a few times a year at most. Why would I want to install an app if they have it?
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#363Earlier quoted context omitted.
One where the developer does not have enough resources to develop for and support multiple platforms?
Right, but the parent's argument is that web notifications are a way to avoid installing a native app.
My argument is not limited to some thin line you define. Please don't speak for me or put words in my mouth that are not true.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#364Earlier quoted context omitted.
I cant imagine a service that you frequent enough to want push notifications but not enough that you would be willing to install a native app for a smoother experience.
One where the developer does not have enough resources to develop for and support multiple platforms?
You get it.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#365I think push notifications and offline support are the real killer features that Apple currently doesn't support. It's kind of funny as a web developer because for the longest time Apple seemed to be the one pushing the mobile web forward but now that web apps are reaching for feature parity with native, Apple's initial momentum seems to be ancient history. It seems Apple still thinks of the mobile web as a content d…
Is there a reason for users to care about this at all? Because it seems to me that this just solves problems for developers while making the user experience worse or not as good as it could be. The same goes for Electron-based apps.
What you fail to understand is that what is good for developers is good for users. Instead of spending resources on maintaining many different code bases, developers can focus on providing a more solid set of features for one.
For instance, maybe instead of being an always online application, they can put in effort at caching for offline use instead of duplicating features across different platforms.
I did my senior project in Electron and there was no way we could have implemented as much as we did if we had to build a native solution for every platform.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#366Earlier quoted context omitted.
A lot of the time web apps aren't even portable across different browsers...so...YMMV in regards to the whole portability thing.
> A lot of the time That was the case in the 90s, and hasn't been the case since. "Some times, that are so rare that people point to it and comment on it on forums", yes.
It's a day to day occurrence, within Web development teams who have different preferences in browser. I've witnessed it in multi companies over the last decade. If you've not noticed it, then it's highly likely you're not testing outside of a single browser. The fact that you think this is a 90s issue shows that you're either extremely junior and arrogant, or totally out of touch with modern Web development. Either that or in denial. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but if nobody says it too you then you're going to continue on in a sorry little bubble of ignorance.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#367I think a lot of commenters here are missing the point and getting distracted by push notifications (who wants a website spamming them with notifications?) and loading screens (hardly a feature). Apple supporting PWA (Progressive Web Apps) is hugely important because it enables a future where web apps can natively support browser, Mac/Windows/Linux desktop, and mobile iPhone/Android/Windows native mobile with a singl…
But as an iOS user I expect you to use the technology stack provided by my preferred operating system. I don't want to use your app if you're targeting a lowest-common-denominator feature set. When I change my preferred text size through accessibility settings, good native apps respond correctly. If I need voice over support, the operating system knows how to read the view hierarchy to me in a logical way. When drag-…
Theres something about this comment that winds me up but I don't have the time to unravel.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#368TIL
> The apps implementing the standard are called progressive web applications, not to be confused with confusingly similar terms like progressive enhancement or responsive apps.
Front-end moves at the speed of light, I reckon it's hard to come up with original names...
My brain already has to remember thousands of software library names and techniques and argument orders, etc. Not making your label meld into people's brains by being similar to other software names in the SAME niche is a good place to start though.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#369I think a lot of commenters here are missing the point and getting distracted by push notifications (who wants a website spamming them with notifications?) and loading screens (hardly a feature). Apple supporting PWA (Progressive Web Apps) is hugely important because it enables a future where web apps can natively support browser, Mac/Windows/Linux desktop, and mobile iPhone/Android/Windows native mobile with a singl…
> Apple supporting PWA (Progressive Web Apps) is hugely important because it enables a future where web apps can natively support browser, Mac/Windows/Linux desktop, and mobile iPhone/Android/Windows native mobile with a single codebase of open technologies.
If 'a single codebase of open technologies' is so important then the same argument says Apple should abandon their platforms in favor of linux/AOSP. I'm sure a number of people here believe that (and strongly) but ... (1) Apple has a few hundred billion counterarguments sitting in the bank and (2) the entire industry has greatly benefited from Apple's efforts at pushing their closed platforms.
And if 'a single codebase of open technologies' isn't the be all end all then the argument reduces to "Apple should subsidize the technology I'm invested in". I bet turnip farmers think Apple should buy lots of turnips too.
Re: Apple’s refusal to support Progressive Web Apps is a detriment to the web
#370Earlier quoted context omitted.
"The best product that can be made will never be made with cross-platform tooling." You're making a circular argument to the original point. If you pointlessly cripple the best "cross-platform toolset" (the web) then of course the products made with it won't be as good. Native mobile apps belong in the same category as desktop apps - they are good when you need close-to-the-metal graphics but there's no reason you sh…
> the best "cross-platform toolset" I've used Electron apps where no such restrictions have been put in place; it has lead me to believe HTML/CSS/JavaScript is nowhere near the best "cross-platform" toolset. It's more accurate to say that it's the lowest common denominator. Electron desktop apps today look and act like Java apps from ten years ago. I'd say that the onus is on web developers to prove that it is capabl…
Have you tried VScode? It feels native. Much more so than Java apps of old (especially Swing).