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Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

theguardian.com

21–30 of 129 posts

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#21

From the actual journal article: > Two additional complications arise because plasma fusion apparatuses are experimental and one-of-a-kind. First, the goodness metric for plasma is not fully established and objective: some amount of human judgement is required to assess an experiment. Second, the boundaries of safe operation are not fully understood: it would be easy for a fully-automated optimisation algorithm to pr…

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Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#22
There are two directions within the energy world that I don't completely get. One of them is hydrogen storage, the other nuclear fusion.

From what I always understood is that the high-energy neutrons produced by the fusion reaction irradiate the surrounding structure and that there is still considerable nuclear waste (although lifetimes are better than with nuclear fission). Do the scientists not care or is this outdated info?

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#24

Google might try to become the conglomerate of all forward-facing things but it is somewhat funny to see how through it all, it's their advertising revenues that form the core of the business.

This pattern happens more often than you think. Microsoft: They make an Operating System and Office Suite. From Microsoft Research they have labs on Quantum Computing, they have five Turing Award winners (One is Leslie Lamport) and he developed TLA+ while employed there. Facebook: A social network Funds a bunch of Deep Learning Research and NLP. Elon Musk: Helped create PayPal, now does electric cars and rockets, (Te…

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Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#25
post #3

Outside of the title being misleading, I'm sceptical. It's one thing to have the hardware for research, and completely other to have the expertise for the research. Google entered the self driving cars research, and we have yet to see them driven around. This heavily reminds me of Intel and their diversification, up until recently, they were in IoT, makers market and what not. One solid push from AMD and they jumped…

>Google entered the self driving cars research, and we have yet to see them driven around. You see their working prototypes flying around mountain view all the time. And, they've been transparent with their progress. People have been working on this since the 80s.

Considering “the whine of the electric motor in Waymo’s 25mph prototype is mildly annoying when my window is open and they drive by several times an hour” is a real thing in my own life as a resident of Mountain View, it’s odd to see the assertion that they don’t drive around.

And I live on a side street.

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#26

From the actual journal article: > Two additional complications arise because plasma fusion apparatuses are experimental and one-of-a-kind. First, the goodness metric for plasma is not fully established and objective: some amount of human judgement is required to assess an experiment. Second, the boundaries of safe operation are not fully understood: it would be easy for a fully-automated optimisation algorithm to pr…

I mean, if it has not been done before, it doesn't look like they're overstating the novelty. Most algorithms look "obvious" in hindsight :).

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#27

There are two directions within the energy world that I don't completely get. One of them is hydrogen storage, the other nuclear fusion. From what I always understood is that the high-energy neutrons produced by the fusion reaction irradiate the surrounding structure and that there is still considerable nuclear waste (although lifetimes are better than with nuclear fission). Do the scientists not care or is this outd…

You're thinking of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutron_activation

You need to use materials that stand up well to neutron bombardment. Many materials upon neutron capture have a half life measured in seconds, which isn't a big deal. As nuclear waste disposal goes, this really isn't a concern.

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#28
Sounds like some promising results, hopefully this approach will continue to be useful.

Addressing the wider article, it always surprises me that the focus fusion approach is never mentioned in fusion articles put out by the mainstream media. I don't know what to attribute that to, but it's surprising that one of the most promising fusion approaches is constantly overlooked.

To give an idea how drastically overlooked focus fusion is, here's a graph showing R&D budgets for different fusion projects...

http://lppfusion.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/fusion-funds...

... and here's a graph showing energy efficiency of fusion devices (running on deuterium I believe)...

http://lppfusion.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/wall-plug-ch...

You'd think that the second most efficient device would've gotten more than $5 million in funding over 20 years (I think the original funding was from NASA back in 1994).

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#29

There are two directions within the energy world that I don't completely get. One of them is hydrogen storage, the other nuclear fusion. From what I always understood is that the high-energy neutrons produced by the fusion reaction irradiate the surrounding structure and that there is still considerable nuclear waste (although lifetimes are better than with nuclear fission). Do the scientists not care or is this outd…

The comparison is not b/w fusion and a hypothetical waste free source of energy. Its b/w fusion and fission. The waste products of fission are much more dangerous, expensive to handle and we still haven't found foolproof, effective ways of disposing them.

OTOH, danger from irradiated materials (whatever that is, this is the first time I'm hearing this TBH) doesn't seem very pressing. I highly doubt any of the irradiated stuff would have a half life of millions of years.

Re: Google and a nuclear fusion company have developed a new algorithm

#30

This is actually a really exciting development to me. (Note, what is exciting is the "optometrist algorithm" from the paper [1] not necessarily googles involvement as pitched in the guardian). Typically a day of shots would need to be programmed out in advance, typically scanning over one dimension (out of hundreds) at a time. It would then take at least a week to analyze the results and create an updated research pl…

As a complete outsider, I don't understand what's special about the "optometrist algorithm." As described in the Nature article it's just hill climbing using humans as the evaluation function.

Isn't it basically the same thing they were already doing but more granular?

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