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Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

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Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#51
post #7

Rapid driving: how ignoring red lights makes the iCar so fast.

Except that this isn't ignoring red lights, it's taking a government approved shortcut that no-one else has done the research to know about (to extend your metaphor). This approach is standards approved:

http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc4436.txt

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#52
post #42
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit disappointed that you're downvoted to grey right now because editing obscure config files and entering esoteric terminal commands is exactly why Linux is so difficult for the average user, and it's never going to improve if those who're already comfortable with it ignore the problem.

The windows equivalent to make such a change would be some kind of hidden module for that scm. Exe or whatever that obscure config tool is called.

In this specific case, the DHCP server configuration under Windows makes it abundantly clear though that you need to make your DHCP server authoritative by adding a warning icon and presenting a warning dialog when it's not running in authoritative mode.

Making it authoritative is then to just press a button in that dialog.

Yes. You have to know that you have to open the GUI for DHCP server configuration in order to configure the DHCP server, but that's really all you need to know to prevent the issue described here.

isc-dhcpd that's often used under linux doesn't even warn to syslog when it's not authoritative. All indication for doing so is given in the sample config file using

    # network, the authoritative directive should be uncommented.
    #authoritative;
It doesn't however explain to you why you should or shouldn't do that and, again, it starts up just fine without this uncommented.

Case in point: Back when I was learning about all of this my Windows-based DHCP servers were all authoritative, whereas none of my Linux or FreeBSD based DHCP servers were.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#53
post #44
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The windows equivalent to make such a change would be some kind of hidden module for that scm. Exe or whatever that obscure config tool is called.

It would still be an easier to navigate GUI tool, possibly with tooltips and online help along the way, than manually editing /etc or /usr/share files.

People say things like this, but if you're not familiar with it the Windows networking GUI configuration is still quite a mess. Especially since Win8 there are now two different GUIs for it, with different feature sets.

There are still some configuration items that have to be set in the registry or through Powershell (wmi and so on). The registry is much worse than editing files in /etc/ because you can't back it up, revision control it, or put comments in.

Random googling reveals people having surprisingly similar problems with the Windows DHCP server: https://community.spiceworks.com/topic/332253-cannot-backup-...

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#54
post #53
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would still be an easier to navigate GUI tool, possibly with tooltips and online help along the way, than manually editing /etc or /usr/share files.

People say things like this, but if you're not familiar with it the Windows networking GUI configuration is still quite a mess. Especially since Win8 there are now two different GUIs for it, with different feature sets. There are still some configuration items that have to be set in the registry or through Powershell (wmi and so on). The registry is much worse than editing files in /etc/ because you can't back it up,…

I am familiar with Windows since version 3.0 and was introduced to UNIX via Xenix.

As for GNU/Linux, I know it since Slackware 2.0.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#55
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would still be an easier to navigate GUI tool, possibly with tooltips and online help along the way, than manually editing /etc or /usr/share files.

In practice, it is still easier to grep and edit config files in /etc (often commented), than to look for the needle in a haystack like gpedit, where, if localized, you don't even know exact term you are looking for.

Not really a fair comparison. For editing config files I often have to go to man pages to find out what the syntax is for the things I want (and sometimes, where to find the file). Especially if editing bash/zsh.rc, there is no hope of getting anything done without Google unless you already know how to do it.

Conversely, most group policies I have ever needed were pointed out, including where to find them, after one web search, and their use is extensively documented in the config editor.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#56
post #3

Could have been titled: How do Apple devices wreak havoc on home networks. When my kid comes home with his iPhone there is a better than even chance that my home network will go out to lunch. Router reboot time. Never happens with Windows or Android devices coming and going.

My SO unfortunately has 2 ipones, an ipad and a MBP. There is a confluence of DHCP activity from all these devices that is guaranteed to take my network down.

DHCP activity from 4 devices will not slow your network, much less take it down.

A DHCP negotiation to get an IP address takes 4 UDP packets, all of them usually below 500 bytes in size.

Not even when you have set the lease time to the theoretical minimum of 1s, this traffic will be at all significant in your network.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#57
post #5

Interesting nugget of information here: > Thanks to Steinar H. Gunderson for pointing out in the comments that the DHCP server on my test network was incorrectly configured. Since I was using a mostly "out of the box" dhcpd configuration from Ubunbtu Linux, it wasn't set up to be authoritative by default, so it wasn't promptly sending NAKs in response to the Galaxy Tab's requests for an old IP address. After fixing t…

> Set authoritative on your dhcpd.conf!

Done: https://github.com/majewsky/system-configuration/commit/f917... :)

Will see if it helps once I get home.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#58

I remember this feature used to cause a lot of problems with random IP conflicts, but I haven't had an IP conflict like that in years, so it seems they've made it a lot more robust. Or are routers/DHCP servers just less broken these days (I guess since Apple's market share has forced them to)?

It does. I had to deal with it many times working at helpdesk.

Re: Rapid DHCP: Or, how do Macs get on the network so fast? (2011)

#59
post #54
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People say things like this, but if you're not familiar with it the Windows networking GUI configuration is still quite a mess. Especially since Win8 there are now two different GUIs for it, with different feature sets. There are still some configuration items that have to be set in the registry or through Powershell (wmi and so on). The registry is much worse than editing files in /etc/ because you can't back it up,…

I am familiar with Windows since version 3.0 and was introduced to UNIX via Xenix. As for GNU/Linux, I know it since Slackware 2.0.

I thought you'd be familiar with it; I was talking about third parties who might not be familiar with either.
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