How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit • Hacker News Board

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#71

Post by stcredzero » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:34 PM UTC

sqeaky wrote: post #54

maxxxxx wrote: post #3

I don't understand why so many people are addicted to outrage, anger and fear. For a while I played along but then I quickly realized that all this stuff is manufactured to manipulate people. Now I can't even stand watching CNN or watching a campaign ad.

How long until a critical mass of people forms to allow some more useful form of news to gain economic momentum? Will it ever happen? If not will the economic repercussions leave us with a decent world or some kind of dystopia?

How long until a critical mass of people forms to allow some more useful form of news to gain economic momentum?

Such things started forming on YouTube (with some problematic elements) but were defunded with an eye towards attracting more old media ad money.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfHXXV45EjE

Phillip DeFranco isn't perfect, but he's graduated from YouTube punk to what passes as a "moderate" there. (I think he's a good way to keep track of the middle of opinion in new media there.) He's also decided to start his own online news network.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#72

Post by hkmurakami » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:34 PM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #35

I would be happy with just opinion free and divisive speech free headlines. If the big outlets could simply start with that, it might be attainable. Words matter. In the meantime. https://legiblenews.com/

The Economist, while not devoid of biases, is as close as we have to this.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#73

Post by eludwig » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:35 PM UTC

A nicely laid out and illustrated article that's well written.

That's about the best I can say. The worst is why? Who is the audience for this? I firmly believe that if you found this article by clicking on a link on the HN homepage, then you already know all this. It's exactly the kind of article we've been reading about in one form or another for 20 years.

If you didn't find this article on the homepage of HN, then the odds are that you will never read it. Why? Because of all of the noise that the very article itself points out!

This is a type of preaching to the choir, imo. Reinforcing to the wrong audience. The points made are fair, but obvious.

But it is pretty! :)

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#74

Post by Mefis » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:43 PM UTC

"Regardless of the dramatic drop in crime over the last 30 years, more than half the population believes crime is worse than it was in years past."

"The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise." - Socrates

This argument keeps popping up. To confirm it we would need a control group. It is likely that even before social media people believed the state of affairs worse than it actually was. Maybe people are more prone to believe that our condition is deteriorating rather than improving.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#75

Post by dageshi » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:45 PM UTC

sqeaky wrote: post #54

maxxxxx wrote: post #3

I don't understand why so many people are addicted to outrage, anger and fear. For a while I played along but then I quickly realized that all this stuff is manufactured to manipulate people. Now I can't even stand watching CNN or watching a campaign ad.

How long until a critical mass of people forms to allow some more useful form of news to gain economic momentum? Will it ever happen? If not will the economic repercussions leave us with a decent world or some kind of dystopia?

I don't think they will, they'll turn off the news completely and follow "news" about other stuff instead. Sports, video games, hobbies, they'll ignore current events and politics or anything else they might find anxiety inducing.

That's what I do anyway, I'm much happier for it.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#76

Post by AdeptusAquinas » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:49 PM UTC

I and I am sure a good percentage of the internet population always struggle with articles like this. I don't have an ad blocker, don't have any 'ad-free' subscriptions to anything, yet I never click an ad while at the same time am not particularly bothered by them. They're just noise, and since they register as basically whitespace in my head, noise easily ignored.

I don't feel 'at war' when I go online, and even if my attention is 'captured', it certainly doesn't translate to any purchased products or revenue for the 'aggressors'.

That being said, I don't dismiss that it does occur: as Max Barry the author said, 'the industry is making multiple billions a year - that money comes from someone' (paraphrased). Just not from me.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#77

Post by tlogan » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:49 PM UTC

maxxxxx wrote: post #3

I don't understand why so many people are addicted to outrage, anger and fear. For a while I played along but then I quickly realized that all this stuff is manufactured to manipulate people. Now I can't even stand watching CNN or watching a campaign ad.

In general, you can sell 3 things: 1) fear, 2) greed, and 3) sex. 30% percent of Internet content is porn. So you have number 3 covered. Selling greed is hard, so lets do fear.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#78

Post by ereyes01 » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:53 PM UTC

eludwig wrote: post #73

A nicely laid out and illustrated article that's well written. That's about the best I can say. The worst is why? Who is the audience for this? I firmly believe that if you found this article by clicking on a link on the HN homepage, then you already know all this. It's exactly the kind of article we've been reading about in one form or another for 20 years. If you didn't find this article on the homepage of HN, then…

I shared the article in my Facebook feed. It will reach at least a couple of friends that are habitual troll victims. I guess to your point, that probably won't stop them from being victims/easy bait. At least they'll read it, hopefully.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#79

Post by jredwards » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:53 PM UTC

eludwig wrote: post #73

A nicely laid out and illustrated article that's well written. That's about the best I can say. The worst is why? Who is the audience for this? I firmly believe that if you found this article by clicking on a link on the HN homepage, then you already know all this. It's exactly the kind of article we've been reading about in one form or another for 20 years. If you didn't find this article on the homepage of HN, then…

I dunno about you, but I clicked because of the sensational headline.

Re: How Fear and Outrage Are Sold for Profit

#80

Post by karllager » Tue, Jul 25, 2017, 6:56 PM UTC

As a kid, I grew up in a country with almost no advertising. Repeat after me: No ads in the streets, in the TV, in the radio, nowhere.

One day we found a magazine (from another country), which contained ads. Two people smoking cigarettes in a strangely alien world, some kind of jungle - or a safari, maybe.

This image was so strange in many ways: Why is it there in a magazine, that was about something completely different? Who does it speak to? What is this strange world depicted there? Why does it feel a so - unreal? And why do the people smile in the picture, even though it is unreal?

Image a day in your life without coming across an ad. Or a week. Or a year.

Take a breath and imagine what the world would feel like.

The need for advertising is deeply rooted in a society, that overproduces things and where a large part of your survival depends on your skill to sell. My deepest hope is that this world will be regarded just as strange as my kids eyes stopped before the strange picture of the two smokers.