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The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

nytimes.com

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Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#331

Post by Waterluvian »

coreyp_1 wrote: post #22

I am having problems with my insurer at this very moment. I went to an in-network hospital for an ER visit, which turned into an 8-day stay (yes, it was serious). Evidently, none of the doctors at the hospital are in-network, however, (claims from various technicians are still "in processing", so I don't know how they will turn out) despite the fact that the hospital itself is definitely in-network. I had no choice a…

My wife and I had a mid-pregnancy scare last year (all is fine). We spent a week as petrified maybe-first-time parents waiting for our turn to get some genetic tests done. I kept returning to the thought about how we had to wait a week, but that people in less fortunate countries might end up facing a massive financial decision. I felt a mix of national pride, relief, and terrible anger for my friends who are forced to intermingle medicine and money.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#332

Post by acdha »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #154
Devthrowaway80 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it won't work. It works in every other developed nation in the world, and they all pay less money for better healthcare outcomes, but hey, the US is Totally Special.

Except that's not how it works everywhere else. Everywhere else the government shoves a telephone pole up the ass of taxpayers and then takes a few splinters to pay for healthcare.

In addition to being wrong about the massive cost differential, this disparagement also ignores the fact that U.S. longevity hasn't kept pace for decades:

https://ourworldindata.org/the-link-between-life-expectancy-...

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#333

Post by sliverstorm »

dragonwriter wrote: post #126
eatbitseveryday wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Luckily I have friends in the industry and it turns out if they fail to inform you within 48 hours that you're not in network you don't have to pay the out of network cost. Curious, can you perhaps provide evidence of this? Seems like a good thing to know. > Call an attorney. This is itself a cost, and maybe only makes sense if you owe ≥ $10k but for procedures billed as $1k when they should be $400 I don't think w…

Many attorneys will provide a free or very low cost initial consultation; you may have an unrealistic picture of what the actual cost of legal services for this particular scenario would be, and may benefit from actually finding out before assuming they are too expensive.

Attorneys have a reputation of charging $600 a visit, much like the hospital bills one is trying to escape.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#334

Post by tptacek »

KekDemaga wrote: post #315
tptacek wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the cost we're measuring! We're measuring cost on the macro scale, in terms of the percentage of the economy spent on health care and, in particular, the percentage of the federal budget spent on health care entitlements. That's the cost curve we're talking about bending, because the pre-ACA projections were literally prima facie untenable. Any number of effective cost-saving measures could be passed that…

Unfortunately for the DNC, the costs many voters were measuring last November wasn't healthcare spending compared to GDP it was actual out of pocket costs that have risen dramatically for many working class Americans.

Can you cite a source for that claim?

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#335

Post by isostatic »

coreyp_1 wrote: post #22

I am having problems with my insurer at this very moment. I went to an in-network hospital for an ER visit, which turned into an 8-day stay (yes, it was serious). Evidently, none of the doctors at the hospital are in-network, however, (claims from various technicians are still "in processing", so I don't know how they will turn out) despite the fact that the hospital itself is definitely in-network. I had no choice a…

"This is ludicrous!"

When US citizens en mass realise they pay three times as much as a country for healthcare that other western countries do, maybe it will change.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#336

Post by grecy »

mistermann wrote: post #115
mikeash wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decades of propaganda has convinced half our electorate that the US's system is the best in the world, and that countries with socialized medicine are hellholes where you have to wait months to get a broken bone looked at.

Similarly, decades of propaganda in Canada has convinced far beyond half our electorate that the Canadian system is the best in the world even though you actually do have to wait several months for treatment if your issue is not "urgent", the definition of urgent being unknown.

>you actually do have to wait several months for treatment if your issue is not "urgent", the definition of urgent being unknown.

Surely even in the actual best in the world, waiting for something that is no urgent simply makes sense and is the only way it can function. Do you expect a hospital to have 5x as many beds and staff as is often required so you can have instant surgery on your non-urgent problem? (i.e. knee replacement)

Of course you wait a little bit while they schedule it in, otherwise it would cost an insane amount of money to have all those resources waiting around for your non-urgent problem.

My experience with "urgent" problems has always been instant in Canada - my broken nose, my brother's separated shoulder and broken legs. Even when I went in a week after being hit by a car I waited all of 5 minutes before a doctor saw me.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#337

Post by isostatic »

0xbear wrote: post #317
tptacek wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the cost we're measuring! We're measuring cost on the macro scale, in terms of the percentage of the economy spent on health care and, in particular, the percentage of the federal budget spent on health care entitlements. That's the cost curve we're talking about bending, because the pre-ACA projections were literally prima facie untenable. Any number of effective cost-saving measures could be passed that…

You can measure whatever you like, but my costs have gone up nearly threefold and my plan is worse now than it used to be. I'm not interested in solving world peace here. I just want to understand why insuring a relatively healthy family of three under a very high deductible plan costs $1700/mo, and why is it now illegal to not go along with this ridiculous rip off.

$1700 a month would be £5,440 a year per person.

The NHS costs about £3,500 a year per person.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#338

Post by KekDemaga »

tptacek wrote: post #334
KekDemaga wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately for the DNC, the costs many voters were measuring last November wasn't healthcare spending compared to GDP it was actual out of pocket costs that have risen dramatically for many working class Americans.

Can you cite a source for that claim?

You need a source for "people care more about their family budgets than percentages of GDP spent on healthcare"? Take a look on how the middle class voted last election.

As for the increase premiums are up 25% in 2017 alone. At the same time deductibles are also rising, its much more money for much less coverage if you are unlucky enough to make over 50k a year or so.

http://fortune.com/2016/10/25/obamacare-insurance-premiums-2...

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#339

Post by ssambros »

kirrent wrote: post #309
mistermann wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bill goes to the government, who gets its funding from the people. This in no way stops any systemic over-billing that may be occuring.

Well, in my country, the government would laugh, and then only pay a standard amount.

And unless they pay enough no providers will do the procedure unless you somehow force them.

Re: The Company Behind Many Surprise Emergency Room Bills

#340

Post by 0xbear »

dankohn1 wrote: post #316
0xbear wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell by looking at my premiums, it actually significantly sped up the growth of costs. I don't know how anyone could argue otherwise with a straight face.

Because premium growth actually has slowed since Obamacare was passed: http://www.factcheck.org/2015/02/slower-premium-growth-under...

Of course they do. Raise the deductible 5-10x and you can claim some pretty interesting "premium reduction" numbers.
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