Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

421–430 of 546 posts

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#421

Post by anigbrowl »

talmand wrote: post #332
anigbrowl wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but consider the situation where A elopes with B (but doesn't get legally married) against the wishes of A's parents, and they have a child C. A tragic car accident puts A and C in the hospital but A is in a coma, and by the time B gets to the hospital A's parents are there and disputing B's eligibility to attend at the bedside of family members.

B should just respond with "those aren't my wife's parents, don't know who they are".

Asserting counterfactuals is the short track to a loss. I encourage you to think through the ramifications of a situation or consult some case histories rather than just documenting your reflexive response.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#423

Post by nbclark »

jimmywanger wrote: post #399
tptacek wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why doesn't this happen more often?

If you give too many benefits to contractors, they become de-facto full time employees, and you have to pay for benefits and health insurance and all that stuff. That happened back in the day with engineers at Google also. They hired a lot of contractors, but you could really only work 6 months out of the year, or else they'd have to classify you as full time with all the attendant benefits. The food and fitness cent…

I was at Microsoft years ago and there was a transition away from providing similar perks to contractors due to a lawsuit.

https://www.reuters.com/article/businesspropicks-us-findlaw-...

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#424

Post by canadian_voter »

mattsfrey wrote: post #422

The argument here should be don't have a kid when you work at chipotle, let alone three. Why is this ludicrously irresponsible behavior not called out? Why do we feel sorry for people who engage in such monstrously stupid and selfish behavior?

Quite right! There should be laws against the poor reproducing. Perhaps a tax on children? Or some sort of permit system? Maybe a one child policy, exceptions only for the rich? Or just take away the children of the poor if they're irresponsible enough to have them and not be able to afford them. Give them to rich families so they can be raised properly.

I wonder if there are any examples in history that we could learn from? Surely other enlightened countries have tried something similar?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#425

Post by shados »

sologoub wrote: post #387
tannhauser23 wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, those outlying areas are great. But they're getting expensive too - you're looking at $700k plus for a townhouse in Walnut Creek, and homes are over a million. And you're already looking at a 45+ minute commute to the city via BART. There's simply no affordable place within an hour of the city. That's not just because of bad public transportation - that's because of poor housing policy.

For sure - these investments need to be made together, otherwise it won't work. Say we build more housing but it's across the bay. Those bridges and BART can only transport so many people. That said, I do think that transportation investment is lacking and should be increased.

Let's build some businesses across there too. So not everyone want/need to all live at the same place, so we don't need everywhere to be NYC.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#426

Post by greglindahl »

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #350
jimrandomh wrote: post #257

This is a problem with zoning in the area. Paying these workers more money would enable them to move out of a garage, but the amount of housing would stay the same, causing prices to rise until someone else is forced into a garage. Unfortunately, local governments in the south Bay area are controlled by people who want to maximize the price of their houses, injury to the poor and middle class be damned.

We really need some regional or state-driven action to drive down housing prices in critical areas. It'd be pretty straightforward - make a "Zoning Authority" tax and levy it on counties, cities, and neighborhoods that do not meet a development target. Want to be an obstructionist NIMBY? I'm fine with that if we're charging you $10k/yr for the privilege.

There is a regional authority which tries to force communities to match new office space with new housing in the same city. And there's state action on the way to force local areas to approve dense developments near transit hubs like Caltrain. Obviously this isn't doing enough today, but there is action happening.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#427

Post by komali2 »

kafkaesq wrote: post #329
tyingq wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Let's please not try to compare the "plight" of contract tech workers I don't personally see a difference other than the average wage for what I do. Companies contract other companies for many things. Janitorial, security guards, software work, etc. They shouldn't be involved in the salary of some other company's workers. If there's a wage issue in this case, it's not Facebook's issue to sort it out.

I don't personally see a difference other than the average wage for what I do. There's this "respect" part, which is one of the major points of the article. And the fact that you apparently don't even see it as an issue -- while those on the other side of the coin insist that it is, in fact, quite a huge issue -- is a great part of what makes it such a huge issue. If there's a wage issue in this case, it's not Facebo…

I wish it didn't have to be a matter for the legislators and the courts, but it seems like capitalism means that facebook has to not do the right thing for the workers if it's more profitable not to - obligation to the shareholders and all that.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#428

Post by canadian_voter »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #16
cabaalis wrote: post #4

Serious question, politics aside. How many jobs have been prior filled by teenagers or recent college graduates, that are no longer being filled by those groups for whatever reason? Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? Edit: 5, per the photo on the article

About half of minimum wage workers are at least 25 and three-quarters are at least 20. http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/09/08/who-makes-mi... >Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? "A man must always live by his work, and his wages must at least be sufficient to maintain him. They must even upon most occasions be somewhat more, otherwise it would be impossible for him to bring…

Adam Smith is such a commie. The man clearly has an agenda. Good thing no one takes his work seriously.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#429

Post by linkregister »

sidlls wrote: post #200
myroon5 wrote: post #164

Almost 80k/year in salary leaves a family stuck in a garage over there? That's absurd

I pay almost $50k/year in rent for my family of four well outside of any city center. We live in a very modest apartment/townhome. That's right: my annual rent is just about the same as the median gross income for a household in this country. It is absurd, but I can easily see a family struggling to live on ~$65k take-home.

That sounds like a good deal for most of SV.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#430

Post by tyingq »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #419
tyingq wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You keep getting back to your experience as an on-site highly paid (compared to most folks) tech worker. Yes, because you implied it came with respect. It doesn't always.

You really seem set on missing kafkaesq's point, take this specific line from the article, and this specific line from you: the distance between the two classes of Facebook workers can feel immense. >I don't personally see a difference other than the average wage for what I do. As a highly-paid tech contractor it is obvious on which side of that class divide you fall. Even though you were a contractor. So when you sa…

No I'm not missing this point I just don't agree with it. Companies contract with other companies for all kinds of services. When I call someone to fix my air conditioner I'm not suddenly responsible for the person fixing the air conditioners wages or social status or class. If Food Service workers are underpaid that's a fair point but it's not something for Facebook to fix.

If the idea is just that Facebook employees should be polite and well-mannered two other types of workers in the building that makes sense.

Edit: I just don't get where the line is. If FB uses ChemLawn to fertilize the grounds, are they also responsible for those workers wage rates? What about the HVAC crew, building maintenance (assuming they work for, say, Smith Building Maintenance) ? If ADP does their payroll is FB responsible for those employees wage rate? Security guards? These food service employees work for a company that provides food for more than one company. I just don't get it. Why isn't their actual employer responsible for their wage rate?

Post reply on HN