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Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

theguardian.com

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Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#141

Post by tyingq »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #53

Everybody here is focusing on real estate. (because young wealthy programmers and older poorer workers have a shared interest in cheap real estate) But I'm really interested in how HN feels about this section: “I felt more secure at my other job. You didn’t have people looking down at you,” Nicole said. Now she works at cafeterias with names like “Epic” and “Living the Dream”, and the distance between the two classes…

They are excluded from events because they are working not for Facebook, but a food service company that contracts for Facebook. Works the other way around too. I've done contract programming, on site, for a blue collar heavy business. I didn't get invited to their functions either. I made more than the the average worker there, because our jobs were not the same.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#142

Post by sokoloff »

akgerber wrote: post #105
wbl wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The valley is not densely populated. It has acres of luxury zoned single family housing.

Neighboring Atherton has a land use goal of 'preserv[ing] the Town's character as a scenic, rural, thickly wooded residential area with abundant open space.'

Should the residents of the town of Atherton be able to vote and enact policies on how Atherton should evolve?

I think they should.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#143

Post by humanrebar »

goatforce5 wrote: post #104
Bartweiss wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At the end of every shift, Nicole watches large amounts of leftover food go into the compost – food that she’s not allowed to take home. On that one in particular - is there a law against that? I know rules on food service workers taking things home vary quite a bit.

I knew someone who worked at a supermarket many years ago when they were in college. Apparently staff were allowed to take home products that were damaged (crumpled/torn packaging, etc.), rather than just throwing them in the trash. Apparently chocolate cookies had an unfortunate and inexplicable habit of being crushed under other products and being deemed unfit for sale. Once the policy changed and staff had to thro…

In a low-margin business, it make sense to pay attention to "loss control" but one of the main benefits of keeping food workers on campus is the productivity gains by the "core business" staff.

That is to say, a take-home box of food a day shouldn't be a problem on financial grounds, so rules like this are more of a power of ethics issue. In abstract.

However, in most cases (I don't know about facebook in particular) food service workers are contractors, and I'm sure the economics don't sort themselves out that way.

Anyway, facebook leadership could discourage this sort of nitpicky loss control.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#144

Post by humanrebar »

Dude2018 wrote: post #94
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #53

Everybody here is focusing on real estate. (because young wealthy programmers and older poorer workers have a shared interest in cheap real estate) But I'm really interested in how HN feels about this section: “I felt more secure at my other job. You didn’t have people looking down at you,” Nicole said. Now she works at cafeterias with names like “Epic” and “Living the Dream”, and the distance between the two classes…

That's how capitalism and meritocracy work unfortunately.

...because non-capitalist systems like totalitarianism and communism are known for their humanity?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#145

Post by Consultant32452 »

nxsynonym wrote: post #22
cabaalis wrote: post #4

Serious question, politics aside. How many jobs have been prior filled by teenagers or recent college graduates, that are no longer being filled by those groups for whatever reason? Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? Edit: 5, per the photo on the article

It's education inflation. a college degree is the new highschool diploma. Even with a 4 year degree in a "real" field of study (business/stem/finance/whatever) it's becoming more and more difficult to land entry level jobs. If you pay 30/60/90k for said degree, you are going to feel entitled (rightfully or not) to working in a position that's not for the "uneducated". These positions still need to be filled though, b…

We wouldn't need 4 year degrees if we hadn't dumbed down public school. We wouldn't need 4 year degrees if employers were allowed to give potential employees an IQ test. Want to become an electrician? You aren't allowed to take an unpaid internship, so what do you have to do instead? Now you have to pay the electrician to teach you in a classroom setting, putting you in massive debt.

>I'm of the opinion that yes, even minimum wage jobs should be able to get the bare minimum expenses of an average family covered (housing/food/medicine), let alone two incomes making more than minimum wage.

Do you support us immediately ceasing trade with China and Mexico? Or is it only a problem when you can actually see the people that can't afford to live a lifestyle similar to yours?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#146

Post by jahaja »

purple-again wrote: post #127
FussyZeus wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point we have to recognize that service workers must be paid a living wage, or be automated. We cannot, morally or economically, have an entire class of worker that we utterly depend on that lives permanently below the poverty line and we just step on them because "they didn't work hard in school" or whichever narrative you prefer to go with for why people who don't have a degree do work that is essential to…

You need to seriously think through every level of what you are suggesting. You want us to revamp the way we handle the complex interactions of individual autonomous groups from one in which your worth is tied to the value you contribute to society (The rapper 50 cent has a lot more money than a brain surgeon because like it or not the value he created for society was much greater than that one surgeons contribution)…

It's called a social welfare system.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#147

Post by gmarx »

rhizome wrote: post #54
gmarx wrote: post #39

It is terrible that he can't live in Menlo Park on 75K. On the other hand the reason he lives in a garage is because he and is family are living with his parents, most likely to save money and avoid the horrendous commute most of his coworkers probably face. On yet a third hand I can't feel all that bad for this guy since he someday stands to inherit a house worth millions of dollars

You had to pull out a third hand, but I'm glad you were able to figure out a reason not to feel bad for them. That was close.

haha, yeah. It's petty but I'm well into adulthood, have what I would have considered an excellent income (had you asked me as a teen) and rent what I would have considered (had you shown me as a teen) kind of dump because my job is here. So yeah I have a bit less sympathy for the people who complain about their income while ignoring the fact that they have a large financial asset which is only ridiculously valuable because of the same things that make it too expensive to live around here.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#148

Post by gmarx »

Johnny555 wrote: post #115
gmarx wrote: post #39

It is terrible that he can't live in Menlo Park on 75K. On the other hand the reason he lives in a garage is because he and is family are living with his parents, most likely to save money and avoid the horrendous commute most of his coworkers probably face. On yet a third hand I can't feel all that bad for this guy since he someday stands to inherit a house worth millions of dollars

On yet a third hand I can't feel all that bad for this guy since he someday stands to inherit a house worth millions of dollars . He's 29 years old, so his parents could be in their 50's. So living in a garage and then inheriting a million dollar house 20 years from now after his kids are grown and out of the house (well, garage) doesn't sound like much to be happy about.

I take it you aren't old enough to have started sweating about retirement ;)

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#149

Post by bsimpson »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #53

Everybody here is focusing on real estate. (because young wealthy programmers and older poorer workers have a shared interest in cheap real estate) But I'm really interested in how HN feels about this section: “I felt more secure at my other job. You didn’t have people looking down at you,” Nicole said. Now she works at cafeterias with names like “Epic” and “Living the Dream”, and the distance between the two classes…

I work for a large company, and it frustrates me that they rely so heavily on contractors for campus support positions. At the same time, the incentives are pointed that way. It's easier to hire vendors to manage non-core services (food, massage, etc.) than to develop those processes in-house. At the same time, it's cheaper to not have to provide equal benefits to vendor employees.

The lack of access to on-site medical or to cultural events like Take Your Kid To Work Day is presumably to draw a clear line between Vendor and Employee. If a group of vendor workers file a class action suit to be reclassified as employees (with backpay/benefits), a company wants to be able to say "Nope, they were vendors. Look at all the ways we made the distinction clear." If they're treated as employees in every way except the payer of their checks, it's a lot harder to justify why they were classified as vendors and received lesser benefits because of it.

I was a temp at another large company before moving to a full-time role at my current one. My contract was capped at 1 year, because without the cap, there was a perceived risk that I could seek to be retroactively classified as an employee and entitled to the benefits I didn't receive as a vendor.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#150

Post by acuozzo »

Dude2018 wrote: post #94
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #53

Everybody here is focusing on real estate. (because young wealthy programmers and older poorer workers have a shared interest in cheap real estate) But I'm really interested in how HN feels about this section: “I felt more secure at my other job. You didn’t have people looking down at you,” Nicole said. Now she works at cafeterias with names like “Epic” and “Living the Dream”, and the distance between the two classes…

That's how capitalism and meritocracy work unfortunately.

> capitalism and meritocracy

No, this is how the market works, but the market is hardly meritocratic. On which merit do you propose we judge workers in order to determine fair compensation for their work?

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