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Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

theguardian.com

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Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#31

Post by henraldp »

nxsynonym wrote: post #22
cabaalis wrote: post #4

Serious question, politics aside. How many jobs have been prior filled by teenagers or recent college graduates, that are no longer being filled by those groups for whatever reason? Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? Edit: 5, per the photo on the article

It's education inflation. a college degree is the new highschool diploma. Even with a 4 year degree in a "real" field of study (business/stem/finance/whatever) it's becoming more and more difficult to land entry level jobs. If you pay 30/60/90k for said degree, you are going to feel entitled (rightfully or not) to working in a position that's not for the "uneducated". These positions still need to be filled though, b…

Should minimum wage jobs pay well enough to raise a family in Palo Alto?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#32

Post by davidiach »

austenallred wrote: post #2

“Back in the day, [the wage] would have been a great number,” said Victor, “but because of Facebook moving in, everything is so expensive. I have to get payday loans sometimes. We barely make it.” They make a combined (rounded) $75,000/year. The real tragedy is that you can't afford to make it in the Bay Area on $75k/yr. I don't think that's something you can blame solely on Facebook.

The only reason $75k/yr is considered low wage has to do with the housing prices in that area.

Everyone knows the solution to that problem is to increase the supply of housing, yet little is being done.

Maybe soon enough, $100k/yr will be the new $75k$. What then?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#33

Post by jclardy »

cabaalis wrote: post #4

Serious question, politics aside. How many jobs have been prior filled by teenagers or recent college graduates, that are no longer being filled by those groups for whatever reason? Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? Edit: 5, per the photo on the article

I think the issue is that the rate we pay people at has not grown much at all, but the cost of living has skyrocketed (Especially housing.) Also education requirements for specialized jobs have increased, and if you fail to use your degree after school then you are pretty much screwed from the accumulated debt.

My grandpa was a mailman his whole life, and supported a family of 5 on that income. He is pretty well off now. Today the average $15 an hour USPS carriers get paid will barely support one person in a small city.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#34

Post by s3r3nity »

austenallred wrote: post #2

“Back in the day, [the wage] would have been a great number,” said Victor, “but because of Facebook moving in, everything is so expensive. I have to get payday loans sometimes. We barely make it.” They make a combined (rounded) $75,000/year. The real tragedy is that you can't afford to make it in the Bay Area on $75k/yr. I don't think that's something you can blame solely on Facebook.

This - the headline of the article is a bit click-bait-y, but you nail the crux of the issue.

When I worked there years back, I recall chatting with a few cafeteria workers and learning that they were paid more than the average contract worker; the issue isn't that they're being paid poorly, but rather that the Valley is _so expensive_ to live in.

It should be more of a commentary on the state of California and the cities north, and including, of San Jose, rather than the tech companies that populate the region.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#35

Post by jmcdiesel »

miguelrochefort wrote: post #7

I wonder how much interest they're paying on those "payday loans".

A good bit. Payday loans aren't something anyone wants to do, ever. They are predatory, they know people only turn to them at the last resort (ie, cant feed your kids) so they can charge whatever they want.

The justice comes in the fact that they lose a shit ton of money, because of how sleazy they are, the important credit companies (Equifax, Transunion, etc) wont work with them, so if you don't pay them back, your only loss is not being able to get more payday loans... (there is a specific payday loan/pawn shop loan credit bureau).

So, dont give people shit if they have to take a payday loan, i've been there... i've had to, when i got laid off and went 2 months without income and borrowed from about every family member I could... i basically asked my prior manager to lie and say i still worked there so i could get a loan to feed my family. I'd never walk into one of those places if I werent in dire straits...

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#36

Post by mc32 »

nxsynonym wrote: post #22
cabaalis wrote: post #4

Serious question, politics aside. How many jobs have been prior filled by teenagers or recent college graduates, that are no longer being filled by those groups for whatever reason? Is every single type of profession required to support a family of 4? Edit: 5, per the photo on the article

It's education inflation. a college degree is the new highschool diploma. Even with a 4 year degree in a "real" field of study (business/stem/finance/whatever) it's becoming more and more difficult to land entry level jobs. If you pay 30/60/90k for said degree, you are going to feel entitled (rightfully or not) to working in a position that's not for the "uneducated". These positions still need to be filled though, b…

Perhaps but consider even in developing economies these kinds of jobs aren't the ones which allow you to raise a middle class family, never mind a doing so in a developed economy.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#37

Post by dgacmu »

jmcdiesel wrote: post #29

Facebook didn't make the area expensive. No tech company did. Those local businesses, and the chains alike, have made it expensive. So much blame gets put on the tech companies, but the tech companies aren't raising the prices, they are just paying people better, and the local businesses abuse that to the fullest extent. There is no NEED to charge $6 for a gallon of milk, when milk from those same cows is sold for $2…

> Facebook didn't make the area expensive. No tech company did. Those local businesses, and the chains alike, have made it expensive. So much blame gets put on the tech companies, but the tech companies aren't raising the prices, they are just paying people better, and the local businesses abuse that to the fullest extent. There is no NEED to charge $6 for a gallon of milk, when milk from those same cows is sold for $2 50 miles away... thats not a SV valley tech company problem, its a SV valley retailer problem, and the blame needs to shift that way...

You're attacking a false target. Buying food in the bay area isn't expensive. Rent and housing is expensive. There's a great Costco in mountain view that charges the same prices as Costco most other places. Similar for other grocery options.

When I lived there last year, our food bills were comparable to living in Pittsburgh. Our rent on a 3br/1ba house, not renovated since 1956, with a portable dishwasher in the garage... was 50% more than my mortgage is in Pittsburgh for a decent size house in a lovely little neighborhood 3/4 of a mile from my work. It was rather shocking.

It's a combination of high salaries and crappy housing policy leading to an explosion in property costs.

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#38

Post by celim307 »

mc32 wrote: post #25

MacDonald's is also a multibillion dollar corp., nobody in their right mind thinks they can raise a family working at MacD's without additional income or subsidy. It's a job for teenagers to get experience and for blue collar retirees to make some money to and to their SS checks. People should stop thinking teenager jobs sustain families. It doesn't have the value add. If you want to make a living open up a stand and…

I don't understand, what point are you making? Your solution is pull yourself up by your bootstraps?

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#39

Post by gmarx »

It is terrible that he can't live in Menlo Park on 75K. On the other hand the reason he lives in a garage is because he and is family are living with his parents, most likely to save money and avoid the horrendous commute most of his coworkers probably face.

On yet a third hand I can't feel all that bad for this guy since he someday stands to inherit a house worth millions of dollars

Re: Cafeteria workers at Facebook struggle to make ends meet

#40

Post by thanksgiving »

thanksgiving wrote: post #9
denzil_correa wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't think that's something you can blame solely on Facebook. I don't think "Facebook" is solely blamed. Facebook is used as a canonical example of SV companies.

> They earn too much to qualify for state health care, but not enough to afford the health insurance offered by their employer. They frequently struggle to find enough money for basics like food and clothes for their children. Victor recently borrowed money from his mother to hold a birthday party for one of his daughters, and from a friend to pay for a dentist appointment. This one might be a little unpopular but it…

> You are delusional or you have serious maths problems: if you can afford to give 100 to 10 people, you automatically afford to give 100 to 100,000 people? What logic is that?

Ah, yes this is what the economists say. They are the delusional ones. Means testing breeds resentment and separates people. No, Scandinavians you don't get a say in this until you have as much "diversity" as we do in the United States.

Here is what I say to the economists (no offense to the news outlet): seriously, screw you. They have to disown Alan Greenspan before I will listen to a word of "logic" from the "economists".

We have two options: eliminate entitlements or raise taxes (or a combination of both). I am OK with either option. What I am not OK with is divisive politics, fear-mongering, hypocrisy.

Raise income taxes as much as you need to and/or lower entitlements as much as we can but let us agree to get rid of means testing. Let us aspire to what Barack Obama said in his speech,

> There is not a liberal America and a conservative America—there is the United States of America. There is not a Black America and a White America and Latino America and Asian America—there's the United States of America.

Thank you.

(PS I didn't flag you)

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