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The long-term cost of sexual harassment

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Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#21

Post by maym86 »

scrollaway wrote: post #8
cottonflop wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure you've never been groped against your will.

Seriously, please don't go tell random people you don't know "pretty sure you've never X", especially if X is related to experiencing distress and/or a traumatic experience. You have no idea whether they have. At best it doesn't add to the conversation, and at worse you're wrong and making everyone feel awful, yourself included.

The first comment about the bar being too low for PTSD did this too. Neither is helpful.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#22

Post by [deleted] »

tptacek wrote: post #15
QAPereo wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is "PTSD-like" if not PTSD? Flashbacks? Panic attacks? Vivid and repeated dreams? Depression? Loss of function? At what point is it not so much "like" PTSD, which is not infrequently ruinous or even fatal to the sufferer, and more like all of the other forms of misery or trauma that don't have a diagnosis? I object in the same way to people who feel sad claiming that they're "Depressed" and that's not harmless e…

Unless you're well-versed with the concept of PTSD, either through research you've done, or because you suffer from it yourself, or because you have a close friend who does, you should be careful talking about it dismissively like this. The popular conception of PTSD is a caricature. In reality, we've only recently begun seriously diagnosing and investigating it, and getting a sense of its prevalence. In particular,…

[deleted]

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#23

Post by coldtea »

cottonflop wrote: post #3
QAPereo wrote: post #2

On one hand that sounds like pretty typically shitty behavior from someone who never imagines that there might be lasting consequences for anyone as a result. On the other hand that's a pretty low bar for a year of PTSD.

Pretty sure you've never been groped against your will.

What that would prove, even if it was true? It's like saying to someone who is arguing against the death penalty "you didn't have your family killed by a robber".

Even if that's true, that might make them more impartial and clear-headed on the issue, rather than less. The same reason that defense lawyers usually reject jurors that had personal experiences about the offence on trial.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#24

Post by damm »

gerdesj wrote: post #16

"He put his arm around my shoulders and whispered “Can’t you pretend you’re single?” in my ear. I shrugged him off. " At that point an approach was made and met with a clear response. That was when things should have stopped. That is how potential relationship escalation should work: an offer is made in some way and based on the response the proposer gets an idea on how to proceed (in this case - bugger off). It is a…

It's one of the biggest problems we have. Typical response from a man is that I'm a great catch; she just doesn't know that she wants me. Once she's had sex with me she'll marry me.

This is actually someone threatening rape (imo). Unfortunately it's something our President has said.

We need to stop this behavior where people think they are entitled to someone else. We also need to have our Law enforcement act more appropriately to handle this; ensure Rape Kits are tested promptly.

Educating our children and adults reminding them what is and what isn't acceptable. It isn't acceptable to touch someone on the shoulder if they asked you to remove it.

Lastly we need to call sexual harassment what it is. It's harassment; it's something as a society we have ignored for far too long.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#25

Post by maym86 »

coldtea wrote: post #20
abalone wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't get to set the bar for her. That's something she was reserving for the most special people in her life, he took it from her, despite clear protestations, and it felt like he faced no real consequences for it. I can see how that could leave one with a pervasive feeling of disempowerment and victimization.

> You don't get to set the bar for her. Words have meanings, just because someone interprets them in their own way, doesn't mean they can claim X when it's not considered warranted. So regardless of this particular case, we can, and do, society collectively does set the bar for what can be considered X or Y -- and someone can argue based on that. (That said, grabbing her hand and not letting go despite attempts to fr…

Not for medical issues. You, or I, or anyone else on here doesn't get to say she doesn't have PTSD. That's up to a doctor.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#26

Post by Mz »

damm wrote: post #24
gerdesj wrote: post #16

"He put his arm around my shoulders and whispered “Can’t you pretend you’re single?” in my ear. I shrugged him off. " At that point an approach was made and met with a clear response. That was when things should have stopped. That is how potential relationship escalation should work: an offer is made in some way and based on the response the proposer gets an idea on how to proceed (in this case - bugger off). It is a…

It's one of the biggest problems we have. Typical response from a man is that I'm a great catch; she just doesn't know that she wants me. Once she's had sex with me she'll marry me. This is actually someone threatening rape (imo). Unfortunately it's something our President has said. We need to stop this behavior where people think they are entitled to someone else. We also need to have our Law enforcement act more ap…

Typical response from a man is that I'm a great catch; she just doesn't know that she wants me. Once she's had sex with me she'll marry me.

It's worse than that. For various reasons, some men are actively more interested if you reject them. It is a little bit like the principle that running from a bear will incite its chase instinct.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#27

Post by greglindahl »

coldtea wrote: post #20
abalone wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't get to set the bar for her. That's something she was reserving for the most special people in her life, he took it from her, despite clear protestations, and it felt like he faced no real consequences for it. I can see how that could leave one with a pervasive feeling of disempowerment and victimization.

> You don't get to set the bar for her. Words have meanings, just because someone interprets them in their own way, doesn't mean they can claim X when it's not considered warranted. So regardless of this particular case, we can, and do, society collectively does set the bar for what can be considered X or Y -- and someone can argue based on that. (That said, grabbing her hand and not letting go despite attempts to fr…

Have you ever looked at the definition of assault and sexual assault? Because those words have meanings, and typically definitions of sexual assault include groping as an example. Not just "sexual harassment and a stressful situation".

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#29

Post by codeisawesome »

Mz wrote: post #14

FYI: The photo in the article is not clearly labeled, but it seems to be a photo of the incident taken at the time it happened. She is a little Asian woman. He towers over her. My assumption is this noticeable size difference contributed to how strongly this incident impacted her.

I can't figure out which party you're being sympathetic to.

Re: The long-term cost of sexual harassment

#30

Post by Mz »

codeisawesome wrote: post #29
Mz wrote: post #14

FYI: The photo in the article is not clearly labeled, but it seems to be a photo of the incident taken at the time it happened. She is a little Asian woman. He towers over her. My assumption is this noticeable size difference contributed to how strongly this incident impacted her.

I can't figure out which party you're being sympathetic to.

My sympathies lie with her.

Any man who doesn't realize that if he has a substantial size advantage, it will be inherently intimidating, is a troglodyte. And he probably wasn't oblivious. He probably happily used that to his advantage as an intimidation tactic.

Men tend to be physically stronger than women, even when their size is pretty comparable. Add a height advantage and things rapidly get ugly.

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