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Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

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Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#181

Post by mason55 »

amyjess wrote: post #138
abrkn wrote: post #85

It's just a matter of time until the store fronts are developed open source on Github and hosted decentralized on a network like MaidSafe. People love to get high and are willing to pay. Innovation will follow to meet demand.

> It's just a matter of time until the store fronts are developed open source on Github Given that Richard Bates faced prosecution for working on the code of the original Silk Road, this could result in very, very bad repercussions. GitHub would very likely be raided, and anyone who committed to or forked the repo could be prosecuted. I don't think anyone wants that to happen. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if Git…

I think it would be much more difficult to prosecute someone for working on a generic storefront application that COULD be used as a darknet market vs. someone who was directly building a darknet market.

There's obviously gradient, because on one side you have Richard Bates and on the other side you have the people who work on Tor. I think that writing a generic "white label anonymous storefront" is much closer to the Tor side than the Silk Road side.

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#183

Post by TylerH »

robotresearcher wrote: post #174
valuearb wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buying drugs doesn't fund those actions. Making drugs illegal does, just like when Prohibition started murderous gang wars, gave us the highest murder rate in modern history, caused thousands of deaths from adulterated spirits, and funded the modern mafia.

Murder is illegal. But somehow the profits from tens of millions of murders aren't injecting cash into a vast underground economy. It's the money that does that.

Except for the small problem of money not being sentient.

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#185

Post by aleksei »

mikeash wrote: post #161
scotty79 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even alcohol? Alcohol is the most endangering drug. Because of wide spread use (no competition because in many places it's the only legal drug), addictiveness, toxicity and intrinsic nastiness of influence it has on some users.

Where is it the only legal drug? Nicotine is often regulated but legal nearly everywhere, and I don't think caffeine is banned anywhere.

I get this is (mostly) a tech site, but do we have to argue semantics every time?

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#186

Post by isoprophlex »

blubb-fish wrote: post #180
wybiral wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it sounds like you're saying big drug dealers are just selling drugs to get money to, I don't know, go on murder sprees No. I'm just saying that the people upstream manufacturing massive quantities of meth and heroin probably aren't the kinds of organizations that you want to be making that kind of money.

and those chemists producing acid in Swiss university labs? are they also eating babies?

Yes, probably, for their fresh pituitary glands..!

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#187

Post by mfoy_ »

mikeash wrote: post #162
mfoy_ wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but debating whether the law itself is bad is a separate discussion. Until the laws change people can't be outraged or surprised when they got caught up in them... Besides, it's possible that many of the users live in countries where _buying_ drugs isn't a crime, or where circumstantial evidence like this isn't enough to warrant opening an investigation. So it's possible that most of these users won't even face…

Surprised, yes, but why can't people be outraged at people suffering from bad laws? That makes no sense.

Not outraged at the laws, outraged at being persecuted.

If you know something is illegal, and it carries a fine of $1,000 and you do it, you get caught, and they fine you $1,000 you can't be like "What?! How DARE you catch me and fine me like the law says?! ARRRGH!"

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#188

Post by BearGoesChirp »

blubb-fish wrote: post #179
BearGoesChirp wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buying drugs can fund actions far worse than just creating drugs. From human slavery (drug mules) to murder. Some of the other things on that list are bad not because the actual item being traded is bad, but because of what the trade enables. I'm not seeing a significant difference between the markets in this regard, except for popularity. Compared to the example you gave, where no one is harmed and no further harm i…

where exactly are those slaves working and murders taking place along the production and distribution of LSD? same question with regard to home grown weed? please, elaborate ...

It promotes growth of the marketplace which also allows buying/selling of drugs that do involve victim crimes. If the market was limited to safely produced/trafficked drugs, it would be different. One might even make the argument that shutting down a market that only allowed victimless drugs end up causing harm.

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#189

Post by 2preserve »

mikeash wrote: post #157
BearGoesChirp wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They fund the ones supplying those drugs which involves a significant harm to society. Just look at people who are unwilling participants in the drug trade or those who receive funds from selling drugs to sell other things such as weapons or even humans. (Yes, I realize legalizing local drug production and distribution would undercut the market, which is one reason why I am for legalization. But that does not excuse…

I'm aware of the huge criminal activity that goes along with drugs like cocaine, but are ecstasy and LSD makers in the same category?

LSD no. Not enough demand. But I would imagine ecstasy attracts a pretty big criminal element. It's been a popular drug for 30 years

Re: Underground Hansa Market taken over and shut down

#190

Post by BearGoesChirp »

oh_sigh wrote: post #167
BearGoesChirp wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buying drugs can fund actions far worse than just creating drugs. From human slavery (drug mules) to murder. Some of the other things on that list are bad not because the actual item being traded is bad, but because of what the trade enables. I'm not seeing a significant difference between the markets in this regard, except for popularity. Compared to the example you gave, where no one is harmed and no further harm i…

You should say " sometimes buying drugs goes to fund actions..." I buy my marijuana from a friend who grows a few plants in his basement. How exactly is that funding slavery and murder?

I've updated to be more specific.

Are such levels of specificity required when talking about other illegal transactions which have a potential to be victimless?

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