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Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

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Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#81

Post by mtgx »

buttershakes wrote: post #26

This is a fight for control of Bitcoin. It is business interests on both sides fighting for a position of authority. SegWit2x is an attempt to remove control from the core dev team, which while technically strong is full of zealots with questionable motives and terrible management skills. Bitcoin ABC and Unlimited have their own parts to play as factions. It's getting tense, but it's been years in the making. Groups…

An article that talks about the purpose of SegWit 2x:

https://medium.com/@WhalePanda/the-corporate-takeover-attemp...

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#83

Post by buttershakes »

jerguismi wrote: post #41
buttershakes wrote: post #26

This is a fight for control of Bitcoin. It is business interests on both sides fighting for a position of authority. SegWit2x is an attempt to remove control from the core dev team, which while technically strong is full of zealots with questionable motives and terrible management skills. Bitcoin ABC and Unlimited have their own parts to play as factions. It's getting tense, but it's been years in the making. Groups…

"I suspect that SegWit2x will end up taking over the network" What? They had first release like yesterday, the project has released one tarball, no packaging, no very good marketing etc. The biggest marketers seem to be the tinfoil hat opponents who fear the fork so much that they speak about it everywhere. I don't think it is at all likely that segwit2x client will gain support. Or if it will gain support, it will t…

The only support it needs is hash power support. That's it. If enough of the hash power can be pulled into it, then it's game over for a minority chain. Running nodes costs almost nothing which means the network can be flooded with segwit2x supporting nodes, and companies will be motivated to switch over.

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#84

Post by kkleindev »

buttershakes wrote: post #26

This is a fight for control of Bitcoin. It is business interests on both sides fighting for a position of authority. SegWit2x is an attempt to remove control from the core dev team, which while technically strong is full of zealots with questionable motives and terrible management skills. Bitcoin ABC and Unlimited have their own parts to play as factions. It's getting tense, but it's been years in the making. Groups…

I always wonder how people external to an organisation can judge the work of an executive. Are you maybe solely looking at outcomes, that may only slightly be influenced by his decisions and dominated by randomness and other factors anyway?

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#85

Post by rjbwork »

DiNovi wrote: post #52
rjbwork wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethereum already went bubble and popped. Maybe it'll go again though. I personally got out @2600 and am probably done with cryptos for a while. Was a good 3 year hold and appreciate though.

Ethereum is up 17x in 4 months. So uh... popped aint the right word

Fair, but it's also down >2x in 1 month so...

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#86

Post by grogenaut »

martinko wrote: post #44
buttershakes wrote: post #26

This is a fight for control of Bitcoin. It is business interests on both sides fighting for a position of authority. SegWit2x is an attempt to remove control from the core dev team, which while technically strong is full of zealots with questionable motives and terrible management skills. Bitcoin ABC and Unlimited have their own parts to play as factions. It's getting tense, but it's been years in the making. Groups…

Good luck with that, I for one will be dumping any bitcoin ABC or unlimited coins. If it by some miracle ends up as the dominant chain, I will walk away from bitcoin for good.

Can you explain why for those of us not following as the bitcoin turns closely.

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#87

Post by jerguismi »

buttershakes wrote: post #83
jerguismi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I suspect that SegWit2x will end up taking over the network" What? They had first release like yesterday, the project has released one tarball, no packaging, no very good marketing etc. The biggest marketers seem to be the tinfoil hat opponents who fear the fork so much that they speak about it everywhere. I don't think it is at all likely that segwit2x client will gain support. Or if it will gain support, it will t…

The only support it needs is hash power support. That's it. If enough of the hash power can be pulled into it, then it's game over for a minority chain. Running nodes costs almost nothing which means the network can be flooded with segwit2x supporting nodes, and companies will be motivated to switch over.

Miners can mine segwit2x blocks all they wish, but since services/exchanges are running core client, they are just mining invalid blocks from their viewpoint, and those blocks are ignored. That means miners can't sell their mined segwit2x bitcoins on exchanges. Mining blocks that services don't accept would be very, very stupid, essentially throwing good money to trash.

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#88

Post by gknoy »

buttershakes wrote: post #83
jerguismi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I suspect that SegWit2x will end up taking over the network" What? They had first release like yesterday, the project has released one tarball, no packaging, no very good marketing etc. The biggest marketers seem to be the tinfoil hat opponents who fear the fork so much that they speak about it everywhere. I don't think it is at all likely that segwit2x client will gain support. Or if it will gain support, it will t…

The only support it needs is hash power support. That's it. If enough of the hash power can be pulled into it, then it's game over for a minority chain. Running nodes costs almost nothing which means the network can be flooded with segwit2x supporting nodes, and companies will be motivated to switch over.

I apologize for asking what is probably a bitcoin-noob question, but can you explain (or elaborate on) why hash power has that effect? What does a "minority chain" mean? If you have two groups using different hashing algorithms, why would that have any effect on either group?

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#89

Post by CalChris »

statoshi wrote: post #48
buttershakes wrote: post #26

This is a fight for control of Bitcoin. It is business interests on both sides fighting for a position of authority. SegWit2x is an attempt to remove control from the core dev team, which while technically strong is full of zealots with questionable motives and terrible management skills. Bitcoin ABC and Unlimited have their own parts to play as factions. It's getting tense, but it's been years in the making. Groups…

Core developers never had control in the first place. No one has control; it's weird to see so many people applying authoritarian concepts to an anti-authoritarian system.

> Core developers never had control in the first place.

True.

> No one has control

Also true. For now.

> it's weird to see so many people applying authoritarian concepts to an anti-authoritarian system.

Not true. First of all, it's a system and you can't get more authoritarian than a system.

Then are externalities called people. And people collude and cooperate and form factions. That's because they're people and that's what people do.

So while they don't have control directly, if they form a majority they will. The minority are free to vacate this virtuality if they don't like the new rules.

You see, BitWorld really isn't so different from the real world.

Re: Bitcoin Is Having a Civil War as It Enters a Critical Month

#90

Post by jbondeson »

Torgo wrote: post #68
jbondeson wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it sad (but not at all surprising) that this is the state of the Bitcoin community. The level of discourse for what is supposed to be a technology that is billed as "liberating money from the whims of governments" has neatly conformed to exactly that of the current state of political discourse. Everyone who disagrees with you is a shill/troll or an idiot. Adding math and "decentralization" doesn't magically pr…

How sad that a human-created and human-run endeavor turned out to be merely human after all.

Yes, that is the one-line throw away dismissal of the whole affair if you innately believe that everything we do will always devolve to the status quo.

I reject this form of behavioral nihilism and prefer to believe that ideas can exact change in this world[1] and move people up and out of the status quo, and lament the failure of even efforts I think were doomed from the beginning.

[1] Which isn't to say I reject the notion that a large portion of people are just out to get theirs and to hell with the rest

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