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Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

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Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#191

Post by morgante »

xiaoma wrote: post #127
morgante wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It helps, but it's certainly not the dominant effect. I don't know anyone who went to an elite university without significant baseline intelligence. I've seen so many students who still didn't do that well even after extensive, expensive tutoring. For example, SAT coaching only increases scores by around 50 points. [0] [0] https://www.jefftk.com/p/sat-coaching-what-effect-size

> " I don't know anyone who went to an elite university without significant baseline intelligence" Oh, I sure do. The strongest positive correlations I've noticed with elite schooling are conscientiousness, acquiescence to authority and then wealth, in that order. Intelligence is a relatively distant 4th place, thought it still correlates positively, IMO. PG actually wrote a whole essay on this topic: http://www.paul…

For what it's worth, I agree with pg and don't think your college is the best predictor of anything (after all, I actually decided not to go to an Ivy myself). That being said, I reject the notion that it's trivial to buy your way into an elite university. There's a whole class of second-tier private colleges that exist primarily because it's not that easy for rich kids to buy their way into the truly top schools.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#192

Post by ultra-jeremyx »

austenallred wrote: post #45
GauntletWizard wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gee, $40k per year? But with huge return on investment in education? Why don't we give people loans, and tie them to their future income? I smell a business opportunity.

Haha. Yeah I'm the founder of https://lambdaschool.com/computer-science - a computer science academy that's free up-front and takes a percentage of salary for two years after you get a job. The side benefit of this model instead of a loan is that if, by chance, you don't get a job in software engineering, you never pay anything . It shifts the risk from the students to the school, which is IMO how it should be. Also…

Is your program appropriate for students who are high school seniors/graduates as a alternative, or lead-in to college? What level of programming experience is required?

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#193

Post by stowaway90210 »

kabuks wrote: post #97
phrowaway21231 wrote: post #34

Shereef Bishay sold out his staff and sold out his mission and he's going to the do the same to his staff at Learner's Guild in Oakland! He sold it off to Kaplan for 80M and his staff (with equity) got nothing!!! I interviewed for a role at Dev bootcamp in 2016 and got an odd feeling from the place and the woman who interviewed me. She took several months to get back to me after I followed up multiple times and wow a…

Hey, what you're saying about me is not true. Please don't do that. Seriously, it hurts.

I was at DBC around the time of the sale and you're full of shit. You checked out, drove tons of taleneted people away (Michael, Lachy, Tony, Jesse, Keith, Zee, Myles, to name a few), and then decided you were bored with bootcamps.

You were in it for yourself and it would have been better for everyone if you could have admitted it. Sounds like you're still believing your own stories.

Kudos to you for hiring and inspiring an amazing team. Too bad you didn't know what to do with it.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#194

Post by scottLobster »

Clubber wrote: post #132
brooklyn_ashey wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad someone said it. Merit= very short bootstraps. This is a much denied truth here in the US, where everyone is so desperate to believe in our national mythology of anyone who works hard can do anything and be anything they want to. This myth can't even carry an aroma of truth these days. No one who has "achieved" anything ever wants to get real and admit how they really got it--- they'd rather tell you and the…

I absolutely agree with what you are saying, but I also believe most hugely successful people who work, work (or worked early in their careers) just as hard as anyone else, they just happen to be working at the right thing with the right people. Of course once you are successful, you can hire people to do most of the work for you while you just monitor. Finding the right thing with the right people is where the socio…

Bill Fernandez (Apple Employee #4) did a nice interview last year where he talked about (among other things) the origins of Apple. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca-LXxMpveE

In it he talks about how Steve Jobs and company were just immersed in a technological community from a young age. They had after-school tech clubs (that the kids actually wanted to go to) as early as elementary school, virtually every Dad on the street was an engineer... yeah, no shit they created Apple. Not discounting the skills of Jobs and Woz, but they had about the most fertile soil possible in which to grow a tech company and a network of contacts from childhood. Listening to that piece made me insanely jealous. Would have killed for that kind of community as a kid.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#195

Post by SilasX »

josephorjoe wrote: post #163

So, three years ago, I was attending DBC and getting my first exposure to web app development. Today, I write code for a living and am enjoying the work I do much more than what I had been doing before. Did DBC give me an education equivalent to a computer science degree? No. Did they teach me everything I need to know about data structures and algorithms? No. Did they help me get my first programming job? Sort of, b…

Same experience here (first DBC cohort). I ended up not being able to make end to end Rails apps, which fortunately didn't matter since it gave enough of a springboard to get into the industry. But I also didn't feel it delivered on what I really needed it to, which was to provide help I can't find on my own and a steady stream of good job leads.

Never underestimate the benefit of being around motivated people.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#196

Post by austenallred »

ultra-jeremyx wrote: post #192
austenallred wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha. Yeah I'm the founder of https://lambdaschool.com/computer-science - a computer science academy that's free up-front and takes a percentage of salary for two years after you get a job. The side benefit of this model instead of a loan is that if, by chance, you don't get a job in software engineering, you never pay anything . It shifts the risk from the students to the school, which is IMO how it should be. Also…

Is your program appropriate for students who are high school seniors/graduates as a alternative, or lead-in to college? What level of programming experience is required?

Yes.

You'll want to know intermediate JavaScript coming in. We have courses that prepare you for that free, so apply and we'll figure it out.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#197

Post by learc83 »

stale2002 wrote: post #185
learc83 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Federal loans (90% of all loans) come with income based repayment plans that charge 10% of your disposable income and are cancelled after 20 years if you don't pay it off. The income based repayment plans are also retroactively available to all Federal borrowers. It's not actually as big of a problem as it sounds.

10% of your income for 20 YEARS. Man, it is funny that people get mad at Bootcamps like app academy for charging 20% of your income for a single year....

It's 10% of your disposable income. You're only going to be paying for 20 years if you make next to no money.

If you don't get a decent job, you'll basically be paying almost nothing for 20 years. If you get a great job, you'll pay it off way before then.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#198

Post by learc83 »

Clubber wrote: post #133
learc83 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's effectively how it works in the US as well for most people. Federal loans (90% of all loans) come with income based repayment plans that charge 10% of your disposable income and are cancelled after 20 years if you don't pay it off.

I don't believe they are cancelled ever. There is a special condition that if you work for the federal government for 20 years, they can be cancelled after 20 years if they aren't paid off, but AFAIK, that's it, and you have to attempt to pay them off during those 20 years. If there is a new exception, please let me know. My wife has some.

If you opt into the income based repayment plan they are cancelled after 20 years of payments. I'm not sure how they retroactively count payments made under old repayment plans if you switch now.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#199

Post by sylvainkalache »

LrnByTeach wrote: post #60
sylvainkalache wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are doing this at Holberton since we announced in 2015. It's a 2-year program based in San Francisco, no upfront tuition but a percentage of students salary when they get a job. The program is also quite different from regular education, we have no formal teachers, no lectures, students learn by working on projects and by collaborating with their classmates. Check us out https://www.holbertonschool.com/ It's indee…

The two business models seems interesting. How do you track students once program completes? how do you know where are they working. How does the legal binding works ? https://www.holbertonschool.com/ https://lambdaschool.com/computer-science

On Holberton side:

-How do you track students once program completes?

We are working with http://vemo.com/, they are specialized in Income Share Agreements (ISA) and the goto in the industry if you want to do ISA. Purdue University is also using them. Vemo request access to students tax return so that we can see their income.

- How does the legal binding works?

Students are supposed to let us know about their employment situation so that we can adjust the payment. The deal is that they pay 17% of their income if they make $50k/year or more. At the end of the year tax time, we do a reconciliation where we compare the amount received against the student income, where the student or the school might owe money to the other part.

What is great about this model is that: -Student only contributes back to the school if they are employed. -Student contribution is proportional to their "financial success". -Holberton can only thrive if its graduates thrive, no bs.

Re: Dev Bootcamp Shutting Down

#200

Post by learc83 »

Larrikin wrote: post #124
phillc73 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not know that. So why all the noise about how expensive tertiary education is in the US?

Large student loans affect your credit and there is no threshold for your salary for when you have to start paying back.

>there is no threshold for your salary for when you have to start paying back.

There is. You pay back 10% of your disposable income. Disposable income is income above 1.5x the Federal poverty level.

If you make less than that, you pay $0.

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