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The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

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Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#201

Post by afarrell »

kerbalspacepro wrote: post #138
Semaphor wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure if it is because of weird tastes or something else. But for sites like Steam, YT, Netflix I always wish for more tuning parameters because their recommendations are all horrible. On Netflix, for example, I get recommended stuff that's similar to other things I didn't like. Amazon is often the best of them for books because their engine seems to only really value the last few things I looked at / bought a…

Regarding Amazon: "Oh, you bought a wallet? Here are twenty wallets of the exact same type but with slightly different colors that you might want to buy, too"

The fact that Amazon doesn't have a way to recommend complimentary products ("oh, you just bought a tent? You probably want some bug spray") boggles.

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#202

Post by softawre »

Semaphor wrote: post #101
ryanbrunner wrote: post #95

I find a lot of sites feel like they're overtuning their recommendation engines, to the detriment of using the site. YouTube is particularly bad for this - given the years of history and somewhat regular viewing of the site, I feel like it should have a relatively good idea of what I'm interested in. Instead, the YouTube homepage seems myopically focused on the last 5-10 videos I watched.

I'm not sure if it is because of weird tastes or something else. But for sites like Steam, YT, Netflix I always wish for more tuning parameters because their recommendations are all horrible. On Netflix, for example, I get recommended stuff that's similar to other things I didn't like. Amazon is often the best of them for books because their engine seems to only really value the last few things I looked at / bought a…

Steam itself doesn't have filtering like that but third-party sites do. Try: https://steamdb.info/

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#203

Post by icebraining »

avar wrote: post #192
icebraining wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having two systems for recommendations would introduce a lot of UI complexity, Do you mean, in terms of implementation or for the user? Because as the later, I think the two are already conceptually different (homepage vs next video), so I don't see how just feeding it different videos would make it more complex.

For the user. What you're describing is still going to cause complex UX. So let's say I'm interested in exactly two things. Russian dash cam videos and videos of trains without narration. I go to the homepage and click on one type of video, what should the next video be? A random video from the two categories? One or the other? Should it show me a banner at the top indicating what recommendation mode I'm in (historic…

Like I said, I think the homepage is already quite different from the next video in the user's perspective, so there's no need to show banners or anything like that. Homepage = full profile analysis, next video = similar to current.

By the way, the Android app does absolutely have an UI equivalent of a homepage, it's even called "Home".

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#204

Post by fletchowns »

afarrell wrote: post #201
kerbalspacepro wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding Amazon: "Oh, you bought a wallet? Here are twenty wallets of the exact same type but with slightly different colors that you might want to buy, too"

The fact that Amazon doesn't have a way to recommend complimentary products ("oh, you just bought a tent? You probably want some bug spray") boggles.

Isn't that what the "frequently bought together" suggestions are?

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#205

Post by inopinatus »

badwolf wrote: post #159
kerbalspacepro wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding Amazon: "Oh, you bought a wallet? Here are twenty wallets of the exact same type but with slightly different colors that you might want to buy, too"

Buy a Dyson vacuum cleaner on Amazon... For the next several weeks Amazon thinks I've taken up the popular hobby of collecting vacuum cleaners

To give some justice to the algorithm, after purchasing my first Dyson I wanted to replace all my vacuum cleaners with Dysen.

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#206

Post by unoti »

Semaphor wrote: post #101
ryanbrunner wrote: post #95

I find a lot of sites feel like they're overtuning their recommendation engines, to the detriment of using the site. YouTube is particularly bad for this - given the years of history and somewhat regular viewing of the site, I feel like it should have a relatively good idea of what I'm interested in. Instead, the YouTube homepage seems myopically focused on the last 5-10 videos I watched.

I'm not sure if it is because of weird tastes or something else. But for sites like Steam, YT, Netflix I always wish for more tuning parameters because their recommendations are all horrible. On Netflix, for example, I get recommended stuff that's similar to other things I didn't like. Amazon is often the best of them for books because their engine seems to only really value the last few things I looked at / bought a…

> for sites like Steam, YT, Netflix I always wish for more tuning parameters because their recommendations are all horrible.

The problem with those recommendation engines is that they're not optimized to serve your needs. They're optimized to serve the goals of their respective companies. And the problem comes when your needs are a little incompatible with the needs of the company.

Consider Netflix for example. Their recommendations don't seem to care much about what you actually enjoy the most. They pay different amounts of money to let you watch different content. So your goal of watching the thing you would enjoy the most is different from whatever the hell their goals are-- probably to get you to watch just enough Netflix to make you not want to cancel your subscription, but not run up their bills on bandwidth and licensing fees.

I'm absolutely confident Netflix could make amazing recommendations-- and probably already has them internally. But it's not in their best interest to give recommendations that are in your best interest.

To the extent that I'm right about this it could be a market opportunity to make an honest and useful recommendation service.

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#207

Post by icebraining »

quadrangle wrote: post #160
icebraining wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does it make better business sense?

Because they aren't trying to help you enjoy videos over the long-term, they're trying to keep you from going over to Facebook where their addictive algorithm will take over and reduce your likelihood of returning to YouTube! It's a classic race-to-the-bottom. If YouTube lets Facebook keep you addicted, you won't get to the long-term. http://timewellspent.io/ is good for perspective

Yes, but that has an unspoken assumption that recent habits are more additive than longer term ones. I find that suspect; after all, you've already shown that you'll go back again and again to these kinds of videos, whereas you might spend a couple of hours watching a bunch of videos of a kind that you'll never be interested in again.

Personally, I find YouTube terrible at keeping me engaged. Even when I want to keep watching videos, their sidebar fails to show me anything I want to click on at least 1/3 of the times.

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#208

Post by detaro »

andreasgonewild wrote: post #60
wutbrodo wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's been proven over and over again that consuming crap like this makes everyone feel bad and hate each other. Consuming posts about theoretical math? Because that's them only content that the article talks about. I'd love to see the research that claims this.

I was rather thinking about consuming bullshit lies about other peoples fabulous lives, algorithmically arranged for maximum impact. But yes, bragging about the size of your intellect falls in the same basket. Google it if you desperately need authority to back up common sense. Most of the stuff people post on Facebook just wouldn't be posted in a less twisted medium, and we would all be better off. I know I'm growin…

> Most of the stuff people post on Facebook just wouldn't be posted in a less twisted medium

The article clearly notes that he crossposts to Facebook. If you think someone posting professional content on their personal website is a twisted medium, I'm really curious about what isn't twisted in your view.

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#209

Post by tgb »

inopinatus wrote: post #205
badwolf wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buy a Dyson vacuum cleaner on Amazon... For the next several weeks Amazon thinks I've taken up the popular hobby of collecting vacuum cleaners

To give some justice to the algorithm, after purchasing my first Dyson I wanted to replace all my vacuum cleaners with Dysen.

How many vacuum cleaners do you have?

Re: The Facebook Algorithm Mom Problem

#210

Post by type0 »

maxxxxx wrote: post #177
kerbalspacepro wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding Amazon: "Oh, you bought a wallet? Here are twenty wallets of the exact same type but with slightly different colors that you might want to buy, too"

Funny story: A while ago I took an Ayurveda class (Indian medicine) and part of it was doing an oil enema. There are devices for this that are also used by a certain population for sexual pleasures. Bought one on Amazon and for months I couldn't show my Amazon page to other people because it was filled with sex toys....

And the lesson here would be not to get involved with Ayrveda.
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