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Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

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Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#151

Post by mendelk »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #86
learc83 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a large firm, a lawyer isn't going to go through the active cases for every partner in the firm when choosing where to take clients for dinner.

It seems a bit naive, then, to assume that the people you're litigating against will civilly keep their anger in Lawyer-Land and never hold a grudge in real life.

I talked to an Oracle lawyer a few months ago, and told him their lawsuit just makes Oracle look bad. The lawyer was dismissive, and tried to explain how it's silly how people take lawsuits personally, and talked about how layers _understand_ that lawsuits aren't personal, and that they are still friends outside the court.

I'm sure a lawyer can "understand" how lawsuits aren't actually something personal at all, but lawyers really seem to be the _only_ people who "understand" that.

-- Linus Torvalds [0]

[0] https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/ksummit-discuss/...

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#152

Post by xattt »

avodonosov wrote: post #143

It was late summer night when I noticed that article on HN. I immediately noticed it's organized like a novel - this popular lame style which often annoys me lately: Matthew Prince knew what was coming. The CEO of Cloudflare, an internet security company and content delivery network in San Francisco, was behind his desk when the emails began to trickle in ... Was he really behind his desk? Hesitated a little before p…

It's emulating the style of writing that Wired pioneered in tech. When Joe Blow tries their hand at it, it's overdone and nuances that makes it great are in all the wrong places.

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#153

Post by criddell »

jacques_chester wrote: post #141
criddell wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> allow third-parties to invalidate patents by showing prior art to the patent office for a nominal fee I think there should be a punitive part to this as well. If you apply for a patent that is later invalidated, then those that licensed the patent should be made repaid. And yes there should be a fee for trying to invalidate a patent, but there should also be a reward if they are successful.

> If you apply for a patent that is later invalidated, then those that licensed the patent should be made repaid. I feel that this effectively says that nobody should be able to license their patent: they would need to hold all of their license fees in reserve against a lawsuit that could happen at any time between the patent grant and the end of the legal system. That or buy insurance which will, no doubt be priced…

So how about once the patent holder is made aware of the prior art, any fees collected after that point are subject to return if the patent is invalidated based in some part on the prior work?

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#154

Post by nstart »

avodonosov wrote: post #143

It was late summer night when I noticed that article on HN. I immediately noticed it's organized like a novel - this popular lame style which often annoys me lately: Matthew Prince knew what was coming. The CEO of Cloudflare, an internet security company and content delivery network in San Francisco, was behind his desk when the emails began to trickle in ... Was he really behind his desk? Hesitated a little before p…

It's a matter of personal taste. The only cautionary advice to writers who employ this style would be to tell them that not all exaggerations are equal.

Sitting behind the desk when the email came in is a harmless exaggeration. It doesn't matter if he was really in bed or at dinner. The dramatic embellishment does little or nothing to change the facts or perceptions in a meaningful way.

If it's ok, we can point to NYT's article on Trump and his aides from some time ago. Aides stumbling in the darkness unable to find light switches type line. Something like that is damaging and deserves proof before writing. Doesn't matter which way you lean, that's dangerous waters since that's been written with an intent to alter perceptions in a meaningful way. To cast a group of people as confused and befuddled.

If this article (the TC cloudflare one) was to write about the patent trolls in a dramatic style that vilified them, that too would be wrong. Something like

"In the photo, Freeman can be seen standing on a bridge with a wry smile as if imagining the future in which the lawyers control the game."

Would be very dangerous and should not be encouraged.

Thankfully this article seems to follow a simple expositional style (somewhat third person narrative of cloudflare's perspective) with a little droplet of drama that just enhances the story rather than manipulating perceptions or reality.

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#156

Post by notyourday »

tareqak wrote: post #150
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems a bit naive, then, to assume that the people you're litigating against will civilly keep their anger in Lawyer-Land and never hold a grudge in real life.

I now have a question about the original account: did the lawyers / legal firm in question: 1. still represent their client (the vegan protestors) with the same utmost care that one would expect in hiring any legal team? 2. politely close the contractual obligation to represent and refund some or all of their fees? 3. just did a poor job of representation after this incident , but still bill the same hours and other…

(2) was the closest. Law firms demanded the retainer payment which vegans did not have so the lawyers withdrew.

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#158

Post by mikekchar »

MatthewWilkes wrote: post #85
mjevans wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software is already covered by /copyright/ law. It does not need patents.

Copyright covers implementations, not ideas. I have no moral objection to truly novel inventions in computer science being protected by patents. An innovative search algorithm, a compression scheme, etc. Its shit when MP3s and GIFs were encumbered, but they were genuine inventions whose sharing publicly genuinely advanced the public good. The kind the patent trolls use are not innovative in the same way. We need a st…

Patents cover implementations, not ideas. Ideas are not patentable. Neither are algorithms. The implementation of an idea in a machine is patentable in most places in the world. The implementation of an algorithm on a machine is patentable in the U.S.

We need better understanding of existing definitions so that we don't rehash the same arguments over and over again.

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#159

Post by saagarjha »

jgrahamc wrote: post #44

More detail on what we are doing from three blog posts: Standing Up to a Dangerous New Breed of Patent Troll https://blog.cloudflare.com/standing-up-to-a-dangerous-new-b... Project Jengo https://blog.cloudflare.com/project-jengo/ Patent Troll Battle Update: Doubling Down on Project Jengo https://blog.cloudflare.com/patent-troll-battle-update-doubl...

Umm…I think you mean Jango Fett, not "Jengo" Fett, in the caption for the first image in the second article.

Re: Cloudflare’s fight with a “patent troll” could alter the game

#160

Post by digitalzombie »

mabbo wrote: post #38

> “[Is Blackbird] doing anything thing that is illegal or unethical?” continues Cheng. “For the most part, it’s unethical. But it’s probably not illegal.” If it's not illegal, more work needs to be done to make it illegal. Inventors always have avenues, moreso today than ever before.

> If it's not illegal, more work needs to be done to make it illegal.

President Obama tried to reform patent trolls but Mitch McConell stopped that. Most of the patent troll shell corp are in Eastern Texas.

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