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NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

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Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#61

Post by infinite8s »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #54
starkfist wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorta true, sorta false. There are not vast quantities of inventory, but there certainly isn't a shortage. There are loads of "luxury rentals" in battery park city, downtown brooklyn and williamsburg that the developers are having a hard time getting people into, even with all sorts of incentives. The prices are pulled out of thin air. The new developments have to charge usurious rents to recoup their costs, but a lo…

Good luck finding a nice place for Fun fact: if an apartment is rented for less than $2000, it becomes subject to rent stabilization. Many landlords would rather have an apartment go vacant than become subject to rent stabilization. Better to lose a year's worth of rent now than 20 years worth of rent in the future, not to mention loss of flexibility (i.e., you can't sell the apt without permission of the tenant).

Do you have any citations for this? Does it only apply to buildings with more than 6 apartments?

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#62

Post by dantheman »

SoftwareMaven wrote: post #35
dman wrote: post #9

Yes getting legislation on your side and suing people will completely undo fundamental shifts that are happening in the real world. NOT. Hotel Chains should be the ones at the front coming up with services like airbnb or integrating them. The hotel brand can offer as a front to loosely federated room providers and the hotel steps in by doing quality control and enforcing standards. In fact people in the hotel industr…

The hotel industry has not changed significantly in a thousand years (maybe more). There are few industries I can think of that are more historically defined than the inn with the inn keeper. Aside from the implications of the traditions, it is also a business model that has worked remarkably well for a long time. I doubt they are going to be keen to jump quickly on a major disruption.

Actually, I think Conrad Hilton revolutionized the hotel industry - the creation of business hotels, providing a similar experience around the world, 99 year leases on property etc. His autobiography "Be My Guest" is actually quite good.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#63

Post by picasso81 »

callmeed wrote: post #45

I think is only going to happen more and more across the country. I understand AirBnB is disruptive to some degree, but you have to consider: - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax - People who are making money on AirBnB by renting out rooms probably aren't paying income tax on it (call it a hunch) - All the sublease/short-term laws tha…

Airbnb didn't invent vacation rentals or sublets. VRBO/Homeaway and Craigslist, the dominant players in the space, have been doing this for years. You bring up good bullet points but if they were real issues, Homeaway probably wouldn't be the $1B company it is today. This is nothing more than hotel lobby groups pushing a bill through their pockets. Occupancy rates are recovering from an all time low (as in lowest in 40 years) and they see cutting off vacation rentals as a strategy for improvement. Mayor Bloomberg even thanks the Hotel lobby groups in his press release http://bit.ly/9iNt3Q. Separately, there seems to be a misconception that Airbnb is hands off with taxes, when in fact hosts who meet the appropriate income standards are issued a 1099 form.

Over time, a city like NY will most likely see a drop in tourism if (a) if the vacation rental industry is removed from the playing field, and (b) hotel prices stay the same (or go back up to 2007 standards). There is a large class of travelers who cannot afford NYC on $300/night rates, and will likely still travel, but choose to spend their money elsewhere.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#64

Post by callmeed »

picasso81 wrote: post #63
callmeed wrote: post #45

I think is only going to happen more and more across the country. I understand AirBnB is disruptive to some degree, but you have to consider: - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax - People who are making money on AirBnB by renting out rooms probably aren't paying income tax on it (call it a hunch) - All the sublease/short-term laws tha…

Airbnb didn't invent vacation rentals or sublets. VRBO/Homeaway and Craigslist, the dominant players in the space, have been doing this for years. You bring up good bullet points but if they were real issues, Homeaway probably wouldn't be the $1B company it is today. This is nothing more than hotel lobby groups pushing a bill through their pockets. Occupancy rates are recovering from an all time low (as in lowest in…

First, I wasn't necessarily taking a side–more posing the question "could enough govt pressue hurt AirBnB's business?"

Second, I think the comparison to VRBO/Homeaway only goes so far. Those 2 sites cater primarily to vacation/2nd home owners (i.e. renting out an entire house/condo for week). You don't see many "Rent out my extra bedroom for $60/night" listings on there. Unless I'm mistaken, that's where AirBnB differentiates itself and, IMO, makes it more risky.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#65

Post by drdew »

madair wrote: post #57
earl wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, try living with me. I live in Ashbury Heights in SF. Our next door neighbor runs a possibly illegal short stay hotel. It sucks ass -- this is a quiet residential neighborhood and he rents to either redneck trash that think it's appropriate to open their car windows, blast country music as loud as their stereos will go, and drink cheap beer on the sidewalk at 2 in the morning or to eurotrash who at least have th…

Sounds like a lot of people are "trash" to you.

They are trash to me too.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#66

Post by dman »

dantheman wrote: post #62
SoftwareMaven wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The hotel industry has not changed significantly in a thousand years (maybe more). There are few industries I can think of that are more historically defined than the inn with the inn keeper. Aside from the implications of the traditions, it is also a business model that has worked remarkably well for a long time. I doubt they are going to be keen to jump quickly on a major disruption.

Actually, I think Conrad Hilton revolutionized the hotel industry - the creation of business hotels, providing a similar experience around the world, 99 year leases on property etc. His autobiography "Be My Guest" is actually quite good.

Thanks for the book recommendation, added to the reading list.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#67

Post by makmanalp »

callmeed wrote: post #45

I think is only going to happen more and more across the country. I understand AirBnB is disruptive to some degree, but you have to consider: - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax - People who are making money on AirBnB by renting out rooms probably aren't paying income tax on it (call it a hunch) - All the sublease/short-term laws tha…

> - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax

Too frickin' bad? I'm of the opinion that taxes should be in compensation for the service provided by the government. What service is being provided here? It makes me angry that just because someone is making money off of something that taxes must sharecrop off of it. As long as the host files their 1099 that came from AirBNB, it seems fine to me. Why is it that a person can stay over and it's no problem but when they pay money it's a huge issue? It makes me think. If this is hurting the hotel business, too bad! Maybe they should look to change their business model instead of trying to pass laws to protect their current one.

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#68

Post by callmeed »

makmanalp wrote: post #67
callmeed wrote: post #45

I think is only going to happen more and more across the country. I understand AirBnB is disruptive to some degree, but you have to consider: - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax - People who are making money on AirBnB by renting out rooms probably aren't paying income tax on it (call it a hunch) - All the sublease/short-term laws tha…

> - Cities that rely on tourism generate revenue from hotel "bed taxes" which are often higher or in addition to sales tax Too frickin' bad? I'm of the opinion that taxes should be in compensation for the service provided by the government. What service is being provided here? It makes me angry that just because someone is making money off of something that taxes must sharecrop off of it. As long as the host files th…

Do people who visit cities/counties for vacation/business trips not require services (indirectly)? Roads, beaches, parks, public restrooms, parking lots, etc. They all have to be maintained.

Come to Pismo Beach (where I'm at) on any Summer weekend. 75%+ of the people on the beach are from out of town. Should I pay higher property taxes to pick up their beer bottles and pay for the extra police officers that need to be on duty?

Re: NY hotels trying to outlaw short-term home sublets (i.e. AirBnB)

#70

Post by sstrudeau »

fgf wrote: post #34
dotcoma wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Home cooking is killing the restaurant industry.

If they could, they would ... Stringent health/safety standards actually do this already. There isn't anyone running small cafes from their kitchens in Manhattan, wich is a shame.

Actually, there are quite a few "underground supper clubs" in NYC. Typically, they're held in private apartments with a prix fixe menu. One article from March on this trend:

http://www.theatlantic.com/food/archive/2010/03/going-rogue-...

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