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Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

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Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#101

Post by luispedrocoelho »

freeduck wrote: post #71

What a strange article, his first issue: "I am happy to be contradicted with data, but too often I see this issue being discussed with links to web articles citing other web articles, finally citing studies which suffer from the issues listed below. Maximum output at work is traded off" while he him self does not cite a single scientific article

I do cite one study, but burden of proof of producing citations is on people claiming that "science shows". I never claim that.

In fact, I found few scientific articles on the subject and the few that I did find were not relevant (for some of the reasons in the text).

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#102

Post by the_cat_kittles »

kevinnk wrote: post #87
the_cat_kittles wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes i wonder about that too. i never thought of myself as someone interested in economics, but i guess thats where you'd look for answers to why some markets are weighted towards winner take all and some aren't. my guess off the top is that it has to do with how easy it is to switch between two competing products, and how economies of scale work in the industry. if there is a big economy of scale, and its easy to swi…

I think the more fundamental connection is that when goods are perfect subsitutes for each other, under perfect information you always choose the "cheaper" good (where "cheap" is defined by whatever metric you're using). Somewhat ironically, this fact actually has connections to the concept of dual variables in constrained optimization problems, the theory of which was largely developed in the Soviet Union for use in…

very interesting! that seems to make sense. do you know of any good writing on examples?

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#103

Post by jack_pp »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #83
apatters wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate on what you believe to be the reasons you're able to work productively for 12 hours a day? I'd love to have that superpower.

Couldn't tell you for certain. Probably some combination of genetics and intense training, with previous periods of long sustained critical work. Often I find I compare whatever my current situation I'm in, with previous tough situations I've dealt with, and know that if I made it through those, then my current situation is tractable. On multiple occasions in a previous life I've worked multiple 24-36 straight hours…

I suspect having peoples lives in your hands is a different kind of pressure than pleasing your manager

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#104

Post by 18nleung »

WalterBright wrote: post #96
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly is - specifically around hiring and work, so it's relevant to this discussion. It's a highly competitive market for talent where small incremental differences make a big difference.

To demonstrate something about capitalism, one should use an example from capitalism, not try to contort something from government into capitalism.

Isn't this essentially a winner-take-all situation, though?

Capitalism tends towards winner-take-all systems, but not all winner-take-all systems are capitalistic. I find the example fitting.

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#105

Post by tanderson92 »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #94
WalterBright wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The astronaut program is not an example of capitalist winner take all.

Mostly is - specifically around hiring and work, so it's relevant to this discussion. It's a highly competitive market for talent where small incremental differences make a big difference.

That is not capitalism. Socialism could have athletic competitions and rigorous selection for public sector programs as well. That is not inconsistent with public ownership of resources.

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#106

Post by ikeyany »

jcranberry wrote: post #88
JustSomeNobody wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which goes towards 60 hour weeks are not sustainable...

A have a couple friends who work dawn until dusk for their startup. After several months they struggled with depression and managing their work life. After a little over a year they've adjusted and it's just routine.

> After a little over a year they've adjusted

You mean they developed depression and gave up having a healthy work-life balance?

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#107

Post by pharrington »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #94
WalterBright wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The astronaut program is not an example of capitalist winner take all.

Mostly is - specifically around hiring and work, so it's relevant to this discussion. It's a highly competitive market for talent where small incremental differences make a big difference.

To clarify, your point is about the nature of competition. Capitalism is but one type of competition. Hiring for astronauts is certainly a competition for resources, but since it is not a flow of transformable resources among a network of profit seeking nodes, it ain't a market.

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#108

Post by AndrewKemendo »

pharrington wrote: post #107
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly is - specifically around hiring and work, so it's relevant to this discussion. It's a highly competitive market for talent where small incremental differences make a big difference.

To clarify, your point is about the nature of competition. Capitalism is but one type of competition. Hiring for astronauts is certainly a competition for resources , but since it is not a flow of transformable resources among a network of profit seeking nodes, it ain't a market.

Spot on. Perhaps I should have clarified that it's a metaphor in the original post.

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#109

Post by AndrewKemendo »

jack_pp wrote: post #103
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't tell you for certain. Probably some combination of genetics and intense training, with previous periods of long sustained critical work. Often I find I compare whatever my current situation I'm in, with previous tough situations I've dealt with, and know that if I made it through those, then my current situation is tractable. On multiple occasions in a previous life I've worked multiple 24-36 straight hours…

I suspect having peoples lives in your hands is a different kind of pressure than pleasing your manager

Right, everything else is trivial in comparison. As a result, working an extra few hours on some Python is just a great thing to be able to get paid for.

Re: Research does not say that people produce more when working 40 hours per week

#110

Post by WalterBright »

18nleung wrote: post #104
WalterBright wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To demonstrate something about capitalism, one should use an example from capitalism, not try to contort something from government into capitalism.

Isn't this essentially a winner-take-all situation, though? Capitalism tends towards winner-take-all systems, but not all winner-take-all systems are capitalistic. I find the example fitting.

It is a winner-take-all situation, but it is not an example of capitalism, and should not be used as an example of capitalism.

Use an example of capitalism to justify an example of capitalism. If capitalism is a winner-take-all system, there should be endless examples.

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